Spider-Man : The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

Yes, I said it. Spider-Man 2 gets all the love and Spider-Man 3 and the Amazing films get all the hate, while this film is promptly ignored.

I dislike Raimi's take on Spidey as a whole. Spider-Man 2 is one of the most overrated blockbusters of all time. It has horrible pacing issues, stiff, awkward and corny acting and dialogue. Maguire is a terrible actor that is a charisma vacuum. He's a simpering, whimpering sack of anti-likability and talent. I don't believe him as a superhero, an everyday young man, or a love interest. His chemistry with MJ is non-existent and painfully awkward to watch. All of their scenes drag and have a cringe level so high it's embarrassing to watch.
The dialogue is over-written melodramatic soap opera crap. Every adult figure in Peter's life gives him the same kind of inspirational after school special pep-talk BS. Aunt May, Otto, Otto's Wife, a random doctor and Dead Dream Uncle Ben. All of them blatantly spout the themes, morals and lessons to Peter is exposition so heavy-handed it leaves mental bruises on the viewers brain.

Raimi's sense of humor is too tongue-in-cheek for the films humor and drama to mesh well. He's not ever overtly making fun of the character, but he constantly winks and nudges to audience saying "this is a little silly, ain't it?" This makes the melodramatic scenes all the more hard to stomach because of how dramatic and serious Raimi directs them. Am I supposed to be invested with Peter as he confesses he's Spider-Man to a public phone? Because I laugh my ass off. This scene could work with better writing and acting. But Maguire is just so pathetically weak in the role...it's nothing but cringe.

The only good thing Spider-Man 2 had going for it is the action. And do I need to mention Spider-Man 3? No, I didn't think so. It's a film that actually gets worse and worse as time goes on. I've re-visited it from time to time trying to find value and all that happens in I keep finding more and more flaws.

Now, the first Raimi Spider-Man has the same kind of tone as the sequels. It's goofy, a little cheesy...but I don't ever feel like Raimi is winking at us like he is in the sequels. There is no "Raindrops" or emo dancing *beep* Peter equivalent here. The conversations and dialogue don't have the preachy sap BS to them like the sequels do. The dialogue is much more earnest, thus making the acting much more earnest. Maguire is actually tolerable here and shares some ok chemistry with Dunst.
In the sequels, the cast is mugging. In this film...they're simply performing. Yeah, Defoe is OTT...but it's the character the Goblin is and his connection to Peter doesn't feels as forced as the one in with Otto in Spidey 2. People praise Molina's Doc Ock for reasons I can't comprehend. All he did was do a pale imitation of Defoe. Defoe may be OTT and silly...but there is a underlying menace to him the whole time. When he screams "Do you know how much I sacrifice!" in a boardroom it may illicit a giggle...but at the same time I feel like this guy is truly unhinged and dangerous. I never once felt any kind of threat from Molina's Ock. When Ock is standing around alone, talking to himself and his arms vowing to finish his experiment and declares nothing will stand in his way...I just giggle because it's goofy. End of.

The script for the first Spidey is fantastically written. It's just about 2hrs and moves like well-oiled machine without ever sacrificing heart or character. I give credit to David Koepp, an underrated Hollywood writer if there ever was one. Yeah, give him crap from Indy 4 or whatever (which was always going to have aliens. So shut up.) but the guy knows how to inject character into scripts and understands plotting. This film tells a near perfect superhero story with 30 minutes less screentime than most superhero films today. If Spider-Man 2 had Koepp onhand, it wouldn't feel nearly as wooden and melodramatic and maybe the performances would have faired better.

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

I agree. I think the thing that makes MJ and Peter better in this is that they like each other. In the other movies they mostly hate each other.
Green Goblin is great! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1L4ZuaVvaw

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

yeah it's a great spiderman movie, i love it, but it's not the only great spiderman movie that sam raimi made

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

Spider-Man is excellent. But Spider-Man 2 is better. Spider-Man 3 is a bit of a mess, but it's still better than TASM 1-2.


A man walks into an Ackbar... Bartender says: It's a trap!

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

OH!

My password is password

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

I thought Maguire was a lot more confident and likeable in 2 than the first film.
Dafoe had good menace but I thought Molina did too and what was especially good with Dr. Octopus is I felt it actually worked for him to be an older, darker reflection of what Peter could be (unfortunately Raimi then went way-overboard with Sandman supposedly being sympathetic and having a personal connection to Peter in 3); he was also effective as a villain who had presence and a story and yet was very much a supporting character/villain rather than a huge focus of the film. I don't see how the acting style is real different or the actors are mugging in the sequels.

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film


I thought Maguire was a lot more confident and likeable in 2 than the first film.

I don't agree at all. Being confident would mean he would go ask some other girl out when MJ tells him she's seeing someone else. Heck, to me personally being confident would be not giving up being Spider-Man though it was forced on him in Spider-Man 2 since he lost his powers. Confident would be him standing up to the people who rudely bumped into him on the college campus. Confident would also mean trying to help the guy who was getting beat up/murdered by calling 911 on a payphone nearby.
Green Goblin is great! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1L4ZuaVvaw

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film


I don't agree at all. Being confident would mean he would go ask some other girl out when MJ tells him she's seeing someone else. Heck, to me personally being confident would be not giving up being Spider-Man though it was forced on him in Spider-Man 2 since he lost his powers. Confident would be him standing up to the people who rudely bumped into him on the college campus. Confident would also mean trying to help the guy who was getting beat up/murdered by calling 911 on a payphone nearby.


Comic book Tony Stark would have never agreed to create Ultron, and he would most definitely not force Bruce Banner to help him out with that. Stark is an inventor, not a conceptualist. He believes that man has to be in control of technology, and not the other way around. Here, one of the primmest examples of how different comic book Tony Stark is from the way he was portrayed in movies:

https://pp.vk.me/c837426/v837426686/fb93/JCqZl4nDaEk.jpg

https://pp.vk.me/c837426/v837426686/fb9d/MoirnLsgcic.jpg

When Stark's cousin Morgan Stark used Ultimo as a substructure of his ship, Stark points how irrational and dangerous it is to make such decisions.

Tony Stark in Age of Ultron acts more like Tony Stark's cousin than actual Tony Stark.

Nevertheless, despite the fact that you always trash Raimi's Spider-Man because of how it's inaccurate, you ignore things like that in movies which you love - Age of Ultron.

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

Dont ever make me read that long of post again. I actually like all 3. 3 gets alot of flack but I still enjoyed it in the theater and own all 3. The first two were better, true. All 3 were superior to andrew garfields WEAK ass spider man movies. Those were god awful

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One of the worst posts I've ever read. How sad do you have to be to write six paragraphs just to troll people?

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This is a pretty fair post. I get the feeling most people like Spiderman 2 better then 1 because the action and VFX are better. The 1st Spiderman movie feels more complete to me, I'm not a fan of the high school to college jump but it feel like a more eventful movie.

The big problem with 2 is that outside the action scenes it's painfully dull. The movie tries to hard to give Parker a personal connection with Doc Ock, and makes Peter too much of a sad sack. Yes Peter Parker always had bad luck but he wasn't a complete pushover. I never liked Tobey as Spiderman but he was tolerable in 1.

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and makes Peter too much of a sad sack. Yes Peter Parker always had bad luck but he wasn't a complete pushover.


I think Rami wanted to make Peter sympathetic, but he went too overboard with it.

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

Spider Man 2 was awesome.

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Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film


The green goblin is a fine villian who comes off as being a nice guy, changed by chemicals and forced into being a bad guy. Its almost sad in a way.


In the comics Norman Osborn was not a nice guy. He's not a good guy gone bad, he's a bad guy gone nuts. Green Goblin/Norman Osborn should never be sympathetic. He's evil and crazy

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In the comics Norman Osborn was not a nice guy. He's not a good guy gone bad, he's a bad guy gone nuts. Green Goblin/Norman Osborn should never be sympathetic. He's evil and crazy


I don't know to whom you replied, since that person deleted its post, but I'm assuming you are criticizing Green Goblin in the first Spider-Man movie. If so... In the comics, The Mandarin is an oriental supremacist-megalomaniac who hold the power of an ancient alien race that crash-landed in China decades and decades ago, in the ancient Valley of Spirits, where he found their ship. Yet, you gave Iron Man 3 a 8 out 10, despite how inaccurate Mandarin was portrayed in it.

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

All the Raimi Spider-Man films range from good to great, the Webb Spider-Man films range from terrible to bad.

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

This is the only GOOD Raimi Spider-Man film.

Spider-Man 2, however, was GREAT.

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

I honestly found this to be the highest quality Spidey movie too, at least story wise as well as acting. The sequels got a little too hammy as they went on, although the special effects in 2 were the best of the trilogy.

Usually the first film in any series is going to be the cream of the crop, that’s when lightning in a bottle is most likely to be caught. Like Star Wars (yes, first is better than Empire you fools), Lord of the Rings, Godfather, Terminator, Alien.

The only thing that could have made Spider-Man a truly GREAT film (as opposed to just a very good one) is if they allowed or Raimi had ramped up his Evil Dead freakiness and unconventionality. Particularly with the Goblin animatronic mask that went unused. It looked terrifying and far more effective than the lame power rangers helmet they went with instead

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The first film is always one of the worst because the Directors vision isn’t fully there.

Terminator 2 is vastly better than the original
The Road Warrior is vastly superior as is Fury Road
Infinity War is vastly better than the first Avengers film

This is particularly true in action franchise films where the first film suffers from a lack of technology and budgetary issues.

But in the case of the Raimi trilogy, Spiderman 2 is vastly better because it doesn’t have to waste all that time explaining the origin of the character and the love story between Peter and Mary Jane gets played out with a resolution….the original leaves us dangling.

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film



Don't tell Harry

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

Eh, I disagree, I actually think that the director’s vision is most apparent in the first outing before things because diluted in the sequel with bigger budgets, bigger stars, and more commercial appeal.

Terminator 2 is vastly better than the original
Oof, you will actually find strong arguments from a certain camp as to why the original remains superior. While the sequel went bigger and louder as a blockbuster, it didn’t retain the horror movie/tech noir vibe that made the first so memorable. It was grittier and more atmospheric, while Judgement Day (while an excellent action picture) felt more kiddified for a larger audience with the family element and also made the Terminator less threatening by essentially turning it into a superhero instead of a slasher villain. Not to mention 2 was largely a repeat of the original anyway, but with more money.if anything, the lack of budget/technology actually aided the 1984 one by leaving a lot to the imagination and giving it that edgy, lo-fi, guerrilla filmmaking vibe. And as a result, everything felt more real and immediate.

The Road Warrior is vastly superior
I will give you TRW. It’s a more fully realized film and doesn’t just ape the first one. But beyond that, better sequels are few and far between. As for the avengers… I’m only counting good movie series

Spiderman 2 is vastly better because it doesn’t have to waste all that time explaining the origin of the character
Which is why 1 is better, as in most series. The initial origin is what is most interesting, or the start of the adventure. The main character is like the audience and doesn’t know what is approaching. That’s why the beginnings of fictional stories feel the more exciting due to the build up. Spiderman2 was good, but nothing beats Peter Parker discovering his powers for the first time and being thrust into the world of superhero

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

felt more kiddified for a larger audience with the family element and also made the Terminator less threatening by essentially turning it into a superhero instead of a slasher villain.

I’m tired of this lamé argument by Terminator fanboys who clearly don’t know what they’re talking about. There is a scene where children catch on fire on a playground from a nuclear blast, a scene where a black family gets terrorized in there home by a gun wielding white assailant, and a teenager almost getting run over by a truck while he rides on a motorcycle. This isn’t some PG-13 watered down version of the 1984 original, it’s dumb to pretend otherwise.

it didn’t retain the horror movie/tech noir vibe that made the first so memorable.

The original Terminator wasn’t memorable though, it’s slasher movie formula had become stale by 1984 (the golden age of slasher was 1980-1982) and I can name a dozen movies that look similar that came out before, the best example of being ‘Maniac’. Heck even the film ‘Hardware’ that was inspired by the Terminator was a darker and better film that did a better job of world building.

Terminator 2 was and is a game changer, it took action movies to another level and redefined what is possible. It’s not just the scope and technology, Sarah Connor goes from being a boring one dimensional “final girl” character to someone with actual depth and screen presence, the storytelling is vastly improved, the score is better, the cinematography, the sound design, the editing, the dialogue, the direction……all vast improvements.

The initial origin is what is most interesting, or the start of the adventure. The main character is like the audience

Everyone and their Grandma is familiar with Spider-man’s origin story, the comics came way before the movie. If this was some obscure character then yeah it would be important but not with Spider-Man, we all know the origin.

Sam Raimi’s first film has all sorts of silliness like the cage match with Macho Man to Green Goblin looking more like a Power Rangers villain all the way to the cringey New Yorkers on the bridge scene.

Spider-Man 2 is a way more polished film with a far more satisfying ending. It definitely feels more aimed at grownups than the first film.

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

I’m tired of this lamé argument by Terminator fanboys who clearly don’t know what they’re talking about. There is a scene where children catch on fire on a playground from a nuclear blast, a scene where a black family gets terrorized in there home by a gun wielding white assailant, and a teenager almost getting run over by a truck while he rides on a motorcycle.
Yeah, and there’s also a Terminator that shoots cops in the kneecaps instead of slaughtering them en masse like the original. As well as a Terminator that smiles and cracks jokey catchphrases like “hasta la vista baybeh” and has father son bonding moments on a road trip. Oh, and this terminator family also single handedly prevents the apocalypse, so I guess all those children burning alive in nuclear fire were just a bad dream after all, and everyone lives happily ever after. Like I said, the bleak nihilism of the original is entirely gone. Also no one said it was some “watered down pg-13 version”, you should stop building a strawman, it’s a bad look.

The original Terminator wasn’t memorable though, it’s slasher movie formula had become stale by 1984 (the golden age of slasher was 1980-1982) and I can name a dozen movies that look similar that came out before, the best example of being ‘Maniac’. Heck even the film ‘Hardware’ that was inspired by the Terminator was a darker and better film
that did a better job of world building.
LOL what a bad take. If it “wasn’t memorable” then it wouldn’t have become a box office hit and launched a franchise. The movie also doesn’t follow a “slasher movie formula” other than having people die in gruesome ways. The film is a paradoxical science fiction love story that had a unique plot. Also please name a scene in either of those two low-rent slashers that had a robot peeling off its own eye or a depiction of a horrific post-apocalyptic holocaust. We’re all waiting. The fact you call some piece of **** B-movie from the 90s better is laughable and makes me think you’re a troll.

dimensional “final girl” character to someone with actual depth and screen presence,
Nah, she goes from a believable person with actual character development into a one-dimensional, boring psychotic dyke. Cameron has a thing for butch women in his movies and it’s too bad he turned Sarah Connor into one like he did with Ellen Ripley.

score is better, the cinematography, the sound design, the editing, the dialogue, the direction
Worse everything except special effects kiddo. You gotta do better than this

Everyone and their Grandma is familiar with Spider-man’s origin story, the comics came way before the movie. If this was some obscure character then yeah it would be important but not with Spider-Man, we all know the origin.
You must be young or something. In 2002 no one knew the origin of Spider Man other than comic book nerds. It was a new event that got people excited, and people were more interested in HOW it was going to be portrayed on screen than what the exact synopsis was anyway. Going by your logic, everyone and their grandma knows what a superhero movie is about. And explain for everyone how 2 was any more exciting when it was just as predictable? Lmao

Sam Raimi’s first film has all sorts of silliness like the cage match with Macho Man to Green Goblin looking more like a Power Rangers villain all the way to the cringey New Yorkers on the bridge scene
And 2 has all sorts of silliness like Aunt May parachuting off buildings like Mary poppins and Spider-Man making small talk in an elevator.

Frankly your arguments are so weak I’m going to write you off as a contrarian troll. Reply if you admit this

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Worse everything except special effects kiddo

The stupidity of a Terminator fanboy in all its glory

The Terminator was so popular that they rushed the sequel out 7 years later, you’re an idiot.

Yeah that cheesy love scene between Sarah Connor and Kyle Reese with the cringe music was terrific, James Cameron was clearly a better director and more wise in 1984 than 10 years later with more experience.

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The fact you ignored all my other points means you conceded you lost.

Also “terminator fanboy”? You’re literally ****ting on the very thing that is responsible for there even being a sequel dumb ****, also the movie that T2 copies BEAT FOR BEAT LMAO get wrekt kid

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Once I realized you were a contrarian troll the decision to concede became quite easy.

Also you use words like “wrekt” which makes you a hipster wannabe loser that’s not worthy of my time. Hopefully when you graduate from High School and get a job you will mature and contribute something worthwhile to society. But until then, I hope you get hit by a drunk driver and spend the rest of your life on a feeding tube you immature little dipshit.

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

Lmfao, I hope you’re raped by a random pack of wild boars!

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

Exorcist,
Jurassic Park,
Iron Man to Name a few..

Without strife, your victory has no meaning.
Without strife, you do not advance.
Without strife, there is only stagnation.

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

You’d be in the minority there

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

The 1st Spiderman made more than the Second One.

Without strife, your victory has no meaning.
Without strife, you do not advance.
Without strife, there is only stagnation.

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

Damn, you’re right.

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film



My password is password

Re: The only GOOD Raimi Spidey Film

Your ignorance shouldn’t be a laughing matter
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