Storytelling : So violence/crime runs in the maid's family?
Re: So violence/crime runs in the maid's family?
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i wasn't feeling only sympathy for the maid in the story. there were a lot of times where i felt uneasy watching/listening to her before she decided to kill everyone. and i think sonlondz was trying to show very subtly throughout the film that she wasn't the martyr she tried to portray herself to be.
even though mikey was a bit of a brat, he did have some wise words (i.e. "you should smile more", "your job isn't that bad") which really rang true when you think about it. and the whole hypnotizing thing was just the father's way of suddenly having a revelation that he better be nicer to his other children (i.e. he wasn't really hypnotized for those who think he was!). you see, when the middle son was in the coma and then mikey tried to hypnotize the dad, from my perspective it seemed like the dad finally said to himself, "hey, perhaps i should be paying more attention to my kid(s) and stop letting rosa be the father/mother to my children." he finally appreciated what he had, but like they say, sometimes you realize things a little too late. he realized how much he loved his family and finally decided to "do something about it," as rosa once remarked. throughout the film, there are many times a character "does something about [their situation]" and we see that, most of the time, there are severe consequences involved.
and i think the father also sensed that rosa wasn't altogether "with it" and decided it was finally time to let her go. that's how i see it. i never saw it as rosa was this innocent woman who was overworked. i always saw it as rosa was a bit resentful and ungrateful for the life she had compared to the family she worked for. just like her son was killed because the woman wouldn't "love" him back, rosa killed the family that wouldn't love her back and give her what she wanted from them. so the father-- whom we think of as this ogre when it came to his son scooby-- was actually the one in the end of the film that had some redeeming qualities to his character. he grew from the tragedy his middle son experienced, and changed his outlook. he became softer and more loving. however, rosa is the one who actually took the downward spiral, and ended up destroying that which she could no longer be a part of.
i think, overall, the film is trying to give the ol' advice of, "be careful what you wish for" as well as, "be thankful for what you've got (because it may be too late once you do!)." ironic how all scooby ever wanted was to be famous and didn't care how. his "connections" (*funny how solondz shows rosa breaking those "connections" of the gas lines at the end of the film to show a literal visual interpretation!*) actually led him to-- what we would assume once the film is over-- an infamous title of, "the boy whose family got killed by the maid." sure, he'll end up on news programs and perhaps even some talk shows and get to do what he wanted to do all along-- talk about himself. and, like his conan o'brein fantasy showed, he wanted his parents to die. once again, a secret wish that materialized. scooby, in a sense, was writing his own story, i.e. "NonFiction".
and, no, i never thought your thread was about race. rosa could have been any race, but that's not the issue. i think solondz just made the character the way she was because it's just how he wanted to portray that particular affluent suburban situation. that's all.
anyway, there are just so many awesome pieces to solondz's films that, when you examine them very carefully, you see how perfectly they all fit together. nothing is wasted in his writing/directing. everything-- at least to me-- has a larger purpose. whether or not solondz intends it that way, i do not know, but not everyone is aware of their own subconscious efforts, now are they? :)
Hollywood films = how we want the world to be.
Independent films = how the world really is.
even though mikey was a bit of a brat, he did have some wise words (i.e. "you should smile more", "your job isn't that bad") which really rang true when you think about it. and the whole hypnotizing thing was just the father's way of suddenly having a revelation that he better be nicer to his other children (i.e. he wasn't really hypnotized for those who think he was!). you see, when the middle son was in the coma and then mikey tried to hypnotize the dad, from my perspective it seemed like the dad finally said to himself, "hey, perhaps i should be paying more attention to my kid(s) and stop letting rosa be the father/mother to my children." he finally appreciated what he had, but like they say, sometimes you realize things a little too late. he realized how much he loved his family and finally decided to "do something about it," as rosa once remarked. throughout the film, there are many times a character "does something about [their situation]" and we see that, most of the time, there are severe consequences involved.
and i think the father also sensed that rosa wasn't altogether "with it" and decided it was finally time to let her go. that's how i see it. i never saw it as rosa was this innocent woman who was overworked. i always saw it as rosa was a bit resentful and ungrateful for the life she had compared to the family she worked for. just like her son was killed because the woman wouldn't "love" him back, rosa killed the family that wouldn't love her back and give her what she wanted from them. so the father-- whom we think of as this ogre when it came to his son scooby-- was actually the one in the end of the film that had some redeeming qualities to his character. he grew from the tragedy his middle son experienced, and changed his outlook. he became softer and more loving. however, rosa is the one who actually took the downward spiral, and ended up destroying that which she could no longer be a part of.
i think, overall, the film is trying to give the ol' advice of, "be careful what you wish for" as well as, "be thankful for what you've got (because it may be too late once you do!)." ironic how all scooby ever wanted was to be famous and didn't care how. his "connections" (*funny how solondz shows rosa breaking those "connections" of the gas lines at the end of the film to show a literal visual interpretation!*) actually led him to-- what we would assume once the film is over-- an infamous title of, "the boy whose family got killed by the maid." sure, he'll end up on news programs and perhaps even some talk shows and get to do what he wanted to do all along-- talk about himself. and, like his conan o'brein fantasy showed, he wanted his parents to die. once again, a secret wish that materialized. scooby, in a sense, was writing his own story, i.e. "NonFiction".
and, no, i never thought your thread was about race. rosa could have been any race, but that's not the issue. i think solondz just made the character the way she was because it's just how he wanted to portray that particular affluent suburban situation. that's all.
anyway, there are just so many awesome pieces to solondz's films that, when you examine them very carefully, you see how perfectly they all fit together. nothing is wasted in his writing/directing. everything-- at least to me-- has a larger purpose. whether or not solondz intends it that way, i do not know, but not everyone is aware of their own subconscious efforts, now are they? :)
Hollywood films = how we want the world to be.
Independent films = how the world really is.
Re: So violence/crime runs in the maid's family?
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^ Now this is a man who knows what he's talking about. Great read.
Re: So violence/crime runs in the maid's family?
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I have 1 question for BlackMagikWoman, just who is "Rosa" ? Are you speaking of the maid? Her character's name is Consuelo.
This oversight makes your comments somewhat questionable. Consuelo is basically overlooked the entire time, she knows nothing but work but the "American" mentality can't even relate. She has family tragedy yet the "American" sentiment is "Oh well, the guy deserved it".
Let's put this all into perspective, you didn't even remember her name.
The boys attitude and complacency toward her basically reflect the American psyche and ironically you have reinforced that mentality.
The American citizens in United States need to realize that many peoples all over this planet don't have cell phones or laptops, they have very little and they do know true poverty. The "American" intellect needs to start looking at these people with respect to their own needs, not just a latin maid, oh well, what's her name, like she doesn't even matter.
This oversight makes your comments somewhat questionable. Consuelo is basically overlooked the entire time, she knows nothing but work but the "American" mentality can't even relate. She has family tragedy yet the "American" sentiment is "Oh well, the guy deserved it".
Let's put this all into perspective, you didn't even remember her name.
The boys attitude and complacency toward her basically reflect the American psyche and ironically you have reinforced that mentality.
The American citizens in United States need to realize that many peoples all over this planet don't have cell phones or laptops, they have very little and they do know true poverty. The "American" intellect needs to start looking at these people with respect to their own needs, not just a latin maid, oh well, what's her name, like she doesn't even matter.
Re: So violence/crime runs in the maid's family?
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"You should smile more" I've found in life is one of the most condescending things you can say to a person.
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Re: So violence/crime runs in the maid's family?
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Well of course it wasn't a thread about "race", it was a thread about the mean maid who killed the whole family, after she was fired! I guess she may have been a 'Latina maid', but that really doesn't factor into it much.
I still don't see why you had to go out of your way to say "This is not about race" when nobody even thought that it was in the first place? Why are you so hyper-sensitive about those things? Is the idea of 'race' something that scares or bothers you? Why did you feel the need to cover for yourself? Just curious.
(PS: I did like this movie, saw it on IFC or Sundance channel!)
I still don't see why you had to go out of your way to say "This is not about race" when nobody even thought that it was in the first place? Why are you so hyper-sensitive about those things? Is the idea of 'race' something that scares or bothers you? Why did you feel the need to cover for yourself? Just curious.
(PS: I did like this movie, saw it on IFC or Sundance channel!)
Re: So violence/crime runs in the maid's family?
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Why are you so hyper-sensitive about those things? Why did you feel the need to cover for yourself? Just curious.
I'm not hyper-sensitive about race, but many people on IMDb boards get themselves worked up over it, which you'll experience firsthand if you spend a long enough time reading posts.
I was merely trying to pre-empt 1) any accusations that I was singling out the maid because of her ethnicity, because I wasn't, and 2) the reverse possibility of racist jerks replying and blaming the maid's actions on her ethnicity.
Pointing out the thought that crime/violence may run in the character's family (by the end, mother and son both have murdered innocent people), when the character is a minority, might be seen by some as an open invitation to a debate about race, which was not my goal. (Race isn't even the right word here- ethnicity is more applicable.)
So by trying to avoid a thread about race, we now have a thread about WHY I was trying to avoid a thread about race. Brilliant. ;)
The war is not meant to be won... it is meant to be continuous.
Re: So violence/crime runs in the maid's family?
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I would blame it on her for being a sociopath who was also enraged and wanted to get back at the family for firing her. That was a shocking end, for sure.
Spiteful childishness can be found in all "ethnicities", in this case, she just so happened to be a Latin maid (not sure if they ever tell us if she is from Mexico, El Salvador, Brazil or Spain! LOL), but don't feel the need to qualify every thing you type beforehand, for fear of some hyper-sensitive racial/political troll taking it out of context! You should be above that.
It seems that 'political correctness' has put you in a tizzy of self-policing that just seems sad to me. Say what you want, f*<k what anybody else thinks or assumes you said! Be unafraid!
"Now, I know I'm pretty, but I ain't as pretty as a coupla titties!"
Spiteful childishness can be found in all "ethnicities", in this case, she just so happened to be a Latin maid (not sure if they ever tell us if she is from Mexico, El Salvador, Brazil or Spain! LOL), but don't feel the need to qualify every thing you type beforehand, for fear of some hyper-sensitive racial/political troll taking it out of context! You should be above that.
It seems that 'political correctness' has put you in a tizzy of self-policing that just seems sad to me. Say what you want, f*<k what anybody else thinks or assumes you said! Be unafraid!
"Now, I know I'm pretty, but I ain't as pretty as a coupla titties!"
Re: So violence/crime runs in the maid's family?
I.Madman, at one point El Salvador is mentioned.
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Re: So violence/crime runs in the maid's family?
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Nice, I like that! Scooby's family were absolutely despicable people who deserved to die.
Who's High Pitch?
Who's High Pitch?
Re: So violence/crime runs in the maid's family?
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http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2228477/Krim-family-murders-Ne w-York-killer-nanny-Yoselyn-Ortega-furious-argument-Marina-Krim.html
When I first heard about this it made me think of Storytelling. The family seems very nice in the article, but I can't help but think of a similar article being written about how wonderful the Livingston's were.
...even in a valley without mountains the wind could still blow.
When I first heard about this it made me think of Storytelling. The family seems very nice in the article, but I can't help but think of a similar article being written about how wonderful the Livingston's were.
...even in a valley without mountains the wind could still blow.
So violence/crime runs in the maid's family?
It struck me in a really twisted way (which I'm sure was Solondz's intention), that the maid, who we mostly sympathize with thoughout the film, ends up a multiple (and child) murderer.
P.S. Failsafe warning: This is not a thread about race. I have not mentioned race once, nor do I see it as a factor in the film elements I just mentioned.
The war is not meant to be won... it is meant to be continuous.