Casablanca : I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

Casablanca is a pretty good film, but to me it isn't great like The Graduate is. I have saw that some people on here regard this film as the best film of all time, are you people seriously saying this film is better than movies like The Shawshank Redemption or Forrest Gump? if so, tell me why it's better.

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

Why don't you start by telling us why you think The Graduate is "great" but Casablanca is only "pretty good"?

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"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." - Hunter S. Thompson

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

I was just more entertained by The Graduate, it was more enjoyable to watch than Casablanca. I enjoyed The Graduate from start to finish, where as Casablanca was a little bit boring in some parts of the movie.

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca


I was just more entertained by The Graduate, it was more enjoyable to watch than Casablanca. I enjoyed The Graduate from start to finish, where as Casablanca was a little bit boring in some parts of the movie. - agswain1987

Then you're talking about your personal tastes and preferences and not some objective evaluation of what constitutes a "great" movie. That's fine, and there is no completely objective measure of greatness or lack thereof. It's ultimately all opinion, and that all boils down to how informed and/or persuasive the opinion is. But only you know what is "enjoyable" or "entertaining" to you personally.

But just as there is no final objective measurement of a film's greatness, comparing films, particularly across eras, can be deceptive as well. The Graduate came out a quarter-century after Casablanca, by which time filmmakers and audiences had matured since 1942.

To me, the most remarkable aspect to Casablanca is that it was never designed to be an epic or a classic. It was simply another Warner Bros. production-line job, a wartime melodrama--what critic Pauline Kael termed "a good hack job"--but all the elements meshed so well that the whole became greater than the sum of its part. And while I hate to drag out the hackneyed phrase "the test of time," it has managed to retain an appeal to subsequent generations of film watchers--and not simply as a "historical curio."

By contrast, I think the first half of The Graduate is great: As Benjamin and Mrs. Robinson become sexually--not romantically--involved, the story has an edginess to it while also being droll and a little poignant. But when, in the second half, Benjamin starts to get involved with Elaine, it becomes a conventional "will he get the girl?" picture that has lost its distinction. (And Mrs. Robinson is certainly cast by the wayside--we don't even learn her first name.) Finally, I will admit to a bias: I have never found any Mike Nichols-directed film I've seen to be "classic." He has a lot of surface sheen that can be quite entertaining (e.g., Primary Colors and even Charlie Wilson's War), but I have never found him to be thoughtful or incisive.

As for the other two films you mentioned, The Shawshank Redemption is a very good film but I don't think it is a "classic," although I would have to see it again to make a judgment as it has been a while. However, Forrest Gump is just heavy-handed symbolism with a lot of the technical hand-waving that Bob Zemeckis, another director big on surface flash but lacking depth, is known for. But that's just my opinion.

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"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." - Hunter S. Thompson

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

what are some of the older films that you have seen, that you recommend I watch?, because the only really old movies I've seen are Casablanca, The Graduate, The Wizard Of Oz, and some of the old Clint Eastwood westerns. I also consider Sling Blade which is my favorite movie, and Glory to be masterpieces, what is your opinion on those two films?

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca


what are some of the older films that you have seen, that you recommend I watch? - agswain1987

Thank you for asking. That is always a tall order, and even with taking a quick peek at what films you've rated, there is really no way to know what your tastes are. You do seem to watch a wide variety of films, which I think is good (or at least similar to my viewing habits), and they do seem to be overwhelmingly from the last 30 to 40 years.

In other words, I'm hardly in a position to recommend anything definitive, either for you personally or as some kind of authority on film. If you are interested in film in general, its history and development, then I would recommend doing a little research on cinema history, which will often include references to "classic" or "historically significant" films.

One point to keep in mind is that film has come a long way, and I think for those who have not been exposed to films from 50 or even now 100 years ago, a lot has changed both in the way films are made and in the way audiences watched them at the time they were made. For example, viewers now regardless of age have been exposed to thousands of "tropes," or storytelling shorthands, through movies and television, and so audiences now don't need to have everything spelled out for them.

Silent films made before the late 1920s are very stylized, with a good deal of pantomime (obviously, as there is no spoken dialog). Early "talkies" in the 1930s can be stagy and melodramatic. Films of the 1940s and 1950s don't have realism we usually expect from today's films, and we get realism today because audiences of today are more mature and experienced when it comes to how "realistic" a film looks. I'm generalizing here for reasons of space, but I think the broad point is that movies from 50 and 75 years ago are quite different than what we're used to today. That in turn may sound obvious, but I'm not sure people really realize that until they start watching those films and begin to compare them to newer films with which they are familiar. And just so I don't sound patronizing about older films, it never fails to surprise me how so many older films can still seem fresh and sharp and even edgy today.

Perhaps one place to start is to watch films that have been remade. I noticed that you've seen the recent versions of The Taking of Pelham One Two Three and Carrie, so if you haven't seen the originals you may want to watch them. Other originals that have been remade include The War of the Worlds, The Manchurian Candidate, and The Day the Earth Stood Still, though of course there have been many others; those three came to mind right away.

As for older "classics," there are so many to choose from, and they'd include such films as Gone with the Wind, The Wizard of Oz, and Citizen Kane, though be warned that GwtW is about four hours long. One "classic" director who has always been popular with audiences is Alfred Hitchcock, and his best-known films include Rear Window, Vertigo, The Birds, and Psycho. (And for me, all of those are among Hitchcock's best although I think that Vertigo is not as "classic" as its current reputation has it.)

Again, though, what I consider "classic" probably does not correspond with what you would consider "classic." As for Sling Blade, I thought it was a very good film (if not "classic") with a compelling performance from Billy Bob Thornton, and as for Glory, it may indeed be a "classic" because it is an outstanding film that still holds up; in fact, I just recorded it off Turner Classic Movies because I haven't seen it in several years.

Hope this help. Happy viewing!

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"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." - Hunter S. Thompson

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

This helped a lot,thank you. I mainly watch dramas, thrillers, and comedies, but I don't mind a good romantic film or horror film every now and then. I plan to watch a few of the Hitchcock movies you mentioned, and Gone With The Wind I will certainly watch the next time I see it on TCM. I went to your page hoping to see some of the movies you've rated, but didn't see any. I guess rating movies on this site is pointless, but I still enjoy it anyway.

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca


This helped a lot,thank you. - agswain1987

My pleasure--thanks for the interest. Enjoy!

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"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." - Hunter S. Thompson

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

See, you're bias about the entertainment value, the subject matter and characters. It has nothing to do with the way the film was told. Yes, The Graduate was and is a great film. It is on the same level as Forrest Gump, The Shawshank Redemption, Pulp Fiction and a lot of other great movies of the 1990s. BUT, it is not as great as Casablanca simply because Casablanca was one of several movies that started modern Hollywood storytelling and it still works in all the same ways it worked then.

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

Thanks to both of you for having an insightful dialogue about movies old and new.

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

I don?t think Casablanca is the greatest film ever made, but I definitely think it's better than all three movies you mentioned.

I do love it though, it's one of my favorite movies. I can concede the point that not everyone who sees it will think it's a GOAT, Casablanca is actually a really easy classic movie to overlook. But it has so many great elements that all just work so damn well that it's resonated with audiences for over 70 years.

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

This movie came out in a time that was defining what it meant to be a timeless Hollywood classic. It was one of several movies to accomplish this feat, including Gone With The Wind and Citizen Kane. That's the biggest reason.

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

I now see that I was wrong, Casablanca is a classic film, not because I believe it is, but because most people regard it as a classic, and it's what the majority of people say and think about a film that really matters. I don't like Rosemary's Baby and China Town that much, but those are two other films that are classics, because most people say they are.

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

I simply enjoyed Casablanca. And I would have, regardless of how many other people enjoyed it. When it comes down to it, Casablanca has a strong script that enabled its performers to give nuanced, at times humorous and at times poignant, performances.

“Hate speech is the modern term for heresy."--Ayaan Hirsi Ali

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

Enduring popularity is one aspect of it. I saw both The Graduate and Casablanca for the first time when I was in my late teens. Graduate was in its initial release in movie theaters and Casablanca was shown at the student cinematheque on my college campus. I loved both films at the time. Since then, I have rewatched Graduate once or twice, but I have seen Casablanca so many times I can hardly count. Every time I see Casablanca I enjoy it. I have no strong desire to see the Graduate again. (Wonderful Simon & Garfunkel soundtrack though - I probably played that several hundred times.)

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

Forrest Gump? Seriously? Gump was a predictable schmaltzy crap fest.

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

I never cared for The Graduate, or The Godfather.




Hitler! C'mon, I'll buy you a glass of lemonade.

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

Everyone has different taste. I find the movies you listed as being fair and nowhere near the greatness of Casablanca.
But that is what makes films wonderful, there is something for everybody's taste. Enjoy the films you hold dear. I am sure many have the same taste as you as many have the same taste as me.

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

Yes, but not by much. I'm not sure how to explain it, though.

Re: I Understand Why The Graduate Is A Classic Film, But Not Casablanca

I have the opposite view. I think Casablance with its quotable lines and good performances and believable storyline is much more entertaining than The Graduate which is overrated with its' cliched romance and overdone characters and standard approach to romantic comedy.

You're an idiot

if you think junk like Forest Gump is better than Casablanca. Yes the Graduate is a great film, but Casablanca is the most historically significant film of WW2. And if you prefer Shawshank better you're retarded.

Mean people suck.

You're cinematically retarded.

Or are you trolling us?

The Graduate is also one of my faves and Casablanca too. If you can't see why the latter is a great film you're just plain stupid.
Especially putting the mediocre IMO Shawshank and Gump above them. Sick.

Mean people suck.
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