Poldark : They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS


Look at it this way: Would anyone ever say, "Whatever wounds you or maims you makes you stronger"?


I agree. I don't see it making their marriage stronger. She may have (rather grudgingly I think) forgiven him, but when trust is betrayed, it takes a long time to get it back - if ever. She said, in an earlier episode, something along the lines of that she had lost respect for him, he was not the person she thought he was. Nothing he has said really changes that. To get her respect back, he is going to have to earn it, over time. I'm not at all convinced he will be able to do that. I'll look at the episodes again and see if I can find the exact quote I was thinking of.

I have seen people mention in various threads that they think some of the things she said when she was angry were out of character for her. I don't think so. Just because she is a nice person doesn't mean she always has to swallow her feelings and act nice. I think her reactions were perfectly normal. She was hurting!

She has given this marriage everything, and he has carelessly kicked it to bits. He doesn't even seem to realise how much he has hurt her. He demonstrated that when he said things like 'It was only one night. How long will it take you to forgive me?' She has been hurt right to the core and he just doesn't get it - what has happened is a game changer. It changes their relationship fundamentally, it changes who she is with him in the relationship. I haven't read the books, so I don't know what happens with them later, but I can't see their marriage ever being put back together properly - maybe patched up, but not much else.


Never lie to the dog.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS


The German philosopher, Friedrich Nietzsche, said: “That which does not kill us, makes us stronger.” It turns out that he was right.

Studies have shown that some trauma survivors report positive changes and enhanced personal development, called post traumatic growth (PTG). PTG refers to any beneficial change resulting from a major life crisis or traumatic event, but people most commonly experience a positive shift by having a renewed appreciation for life; adopting a new world view with new possibilities for themselves; feeling more personal strength; feeling more satisfied spiritually, and/or their relationships improve.



I am 70+ and have had many "adventures and misadventures" in my life. Although I wanted to die because of a couple being almost unbearable, I did not. Getting through heart breaking experiences can cause tremendous wear and tear on a life and its body, whether it is an abandoned dog or an abandoned spouse. I eventually realized that death can come in a variety of ways that I never knew until I was in a destructive marriage. Once of the worst is the death of trust.

Although I have only seen as far as S2E6, like others, I have seen portions of the next ones on YouTube. Perhaps the writer and/or director went too long with Demelza's hurt and rage, yet what was shown is truly what I felt. Exactly like that through the various degrees until my - mostly non-verbal - contempt died to complete indifference that was portrayed by very polite, short sentences that one shows to an inconvenient stranger. The difference is that my marriage was arranged and I never was never in love with my husband. Demelza's fury is that she bonded to him and his life in every way possible. It is a huge gulf from my trials to what she lives through.

My situation was in being very grateful to end my marriage and in wishing happiness to my former husband; which was a last act of marital civility via feeling nothing except relief.

For Demelza, she can't look at Ross without seeing where she was before he dragged her to the water pump to wash her hair the first time. She fell completely in love with him, his life, his home, his animals, even Jud and Prudie; she was even working as much as three servants just for the privilege of being near Ross. She became more of a Poldark in some ways than Ross might ever be. While it is only fiction, I watched that miserable misfire of an apology with tears sliding down my face because it felt chokingly real.

It sounds like Eleanor and Aiden were defrauded in the time owed to their characters to have a significant make-up, yet they appear to have wrought gold from the tin they were given. It felt like watching lightening indoors.





A Checkered Life speaks of myriad diverse adventures being the rewards of endless curiosity.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Oh, ACL. What a heart breaking, yet perceptive, post.

I suppose that philosopher's observation means that all of life's experience can give us wisdom and insight, if we allow it. Perhaps wisdom that we can pass on to others, or, at least, patience and understanding of another's situation.

I agree with you about Demelza. She had esteemed Ross, and his fall was harder in her eyes.


It sounds like Eleanor and Aiden were defrauded in the time owed to their characters to have a significant make-up, yet they appear to have wrought gold from the tin they were given.

So true! If time hadn't been given over to that silly miner's insurrection....









If there aren't any skeletons in a man's closet, there's probably a Bertha in his attic.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Beautifully said, A-Checkered-Life! I thought Demelza's reactions rang perfectly true as well. Demelza found herself having to face a life without Ross, her one great love, and though initially she found the weight of that crushing, she eventually found that she was strong enough to walk away - "I'm not concerned with what you choose. Only what I choose". In a very real and healthy way he's been knocked off of his pedestal too. She now knows she can live without him if she had to so he will never have that hold on her again.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

I think as Ross had an idealised view of Elizabeth, demelza had an idealised view of Ross, which was slowly eroded this series from smuggling to the affair. She had thought he was completely moral, but now doesn't think she knows him. The marriage certainly is no longer stronger, but they may know each other better.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

In addition to the emotional growth due to the affair, there's something else: Ross is finally able to put the love he feels for Elizabeth behind him. In a way that that cloud was always hanging over the marriage. Demelza certainly knew that he had unresolved feelings about Elizabeth (before and during the marriage) and which becomes a threat to be marriage to varying degrees. Although Demelza will always have insecurities about it, Ross is finally able to leave his relationship with Elizabeth in the past, will no longer hold out a candle for her and doesn't ever serious consider straying again.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

I agree with you on every point. It's like a vase that gets knocked over and shatters. You may be able to glue the pieces back together but the cracks will always be there. That's the permanent and steep price that Ross' betrayal cost both him and Demelza.

That gets me to thinking though. If someone comes along later and knocks over the same vase...can you really break something that was already broken? I'm just thinking ahead to the VHT (see, Joseph, I'm doing my part to get it to catch on ).

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

I will say this (only mildly spoilerish): The Black Moon is a very happy book for Ross and Demelza. In fact, of the seven original novels, it's second only to Ross Poldark in that respect. This novel is where the reconciliation at the very end of Warleggan really pays off. (Sometimes I wish Graham had stopped the saga after TBM, in fact.) Graham provides us with a careful assessment of the couple's relationship at that point in their lives:


Now it seemed incredible that they had been so near to parting. The warmth of their reconciliation had been full of passion, had brought them closer in some ways than they had ever been before, all defences down. Yet it had been a slightly feverish warmth -- and still was -- as if their relationship were recovering from a near-mortal wound and they were trying to reassure themselves. The quieter levels of absolute trust which had existed before had not yet been regained.

And tempering their delight and relief at the success of the mine was the knowledge of the alien presence at Trenwith House only four miles away. Often they would forget it; then it would recur like an undulant pain, so that temporarily they were at a distance from each other again. The birth and christening of Valentine Warleggan was the latest thorn in the flesh. Neither said what was uppermost in their minds; it could never be uttered by anyone.


What happens in The Four Swans and The Angry Tide is that the tiny fissures to which Graham alludes widen, leading to the VHT and its painful aftermath. And for all the years after that, the VVT continues to rankle at times. Thus, the VBT, as a contributing factor to the VHT and the direct cause of the VVT, is never fully erased from Ross and Demelza's life together, even if they do manage to forget it much of the time.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Oh, for heaven's sake, what's the VVT? Lol.




If there aren't any skeletons in a man's closet, there's probably a Bertha in his attic.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Very Val[entine] Thing!

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Who is the "alien presence at Trenwith"? Is it George or Valentine?

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Surprised both Ross and Delmeza did'nt question it right away when Demelza told him after the siege.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS


Surprised both Ross and Delmeza did'nt question it right away when Demelza told him after the siege.


What does Demelza tell him after the siege?
If you are referring to Elizabeth's pregnancy, then I didn't see her tell Ross about it. In fact, I was puzzled as to how Ross learnt of it, because he never saw Elizabeth himself, and the show doesn't have Demelza tell Ross about it.
Or are we to assume she told him, because as they return to Nampara, he says, "So she is with child?"

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

The presence is the whole Warleggan family, I think.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

I forgot to add that although the broken vase metaphor is often used to describe a damaged relationship -- Graham uses it himself in Warleggan -- I don't think it quite fits. A vase is a simple, static, inorganic object. It has to be patched from the outside. A broken bone is a better comparison, because a bone can heal itself. It grows back. With proper medical care, nutrition, and time, it can return to just about as good as new. Of course, outcomes differ, and there may be residual weakness, or sporadic pain at the site of the break. The goal for R and D after the VBT is not to piece together their old relationship exactly as it was, but to grow new bonds to supplement the originals.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Well that is perfectly fine if you don't view it that way, but, I certainly think it can be true depending on how you learn and grow from brokenness and apply it to your future and life. I don't think I would even be here...if some circumstances were different. I don't look at it from a physically wounded perspective but more a trials and tribulations perspective and if you make it through and rise above it, it makes you better able to handle more later (and life continues to give us hard things to handle), can strengthens bonds in relationships and also have compassion for others around you going through difficult times as well. It can give you the ability to understand what others are going through that at one time you might not have understood or related at all. I'm not saying there are not closed wounds left over that can't be easily reopened at times, I'm just saying there is a healing that can follow if you allow it and it can change you, or break you (or your marriage) and make you a better person or make your marriage a better marriage if you are able to move past it. Trust is hard to regain, but, I don't think it is impossible to regain. It can be over time with patience and communication (something not so easy for R & D). Demelza loves Ross and Ross loves Demelza. That'd certainly a plus. Big mistakes were made, more will be made for sure probably (Ive not read the books) but it seems they do make it.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Good post. Think that's probably true. Though he should have spent the next weeks trying to apologise to demelza, but he barely did and almost left to run away to war instead of trying to repair the damage. I think it's a bit of bad writing or done for dramatic effect.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

The thing is, when Elizabeth visited Demelza, she still approached warmly and was surprised when demelza was so cold. So she couldn't visit or stay there for a while. And she had no idea on running her manor, so you can see why she wanted Ross. As a by-product it may have made them closer and she longed for Ross, but never did anything especially provocative.

When she said the comment about two loves, Francis was still alive, and there was no way she wanted to take it further, she was just showing him she still had affection. Ross approached her later in the room and she pretty much turned his advances down.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Liz could have been a lot more awful to Demelza, when they met in the garden Liz could have confessed that Ross had raped her, how would Delmeza feel about having a man back who abused a woman that way.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Yea. I think maybe Elizabeth is betrayed worse in the books but on screen she seems without malice. She even helps demelza settle in the first parties.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

I liked the finale.

"Please, if you are trying to convert me, this isn't a good time"

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

I really loved this finale episode and I especially loved how they ended it too. I actually got very emotional in that last scene (on the cliff of course). I am so attached to these characters and after so many episodes of Demelza's dissing (which Ross deserved but it was still really wearing on me)and the sadness and harshness between them, it felt like the weight of the world had finally lifted. I was so elated that Ross finally realized what he had done, how much he had hurt her, and told D it was she whom he loved and in his eloquent way of saying I'm sorry (finally). That scene at the end was breathtaking and fitting too for the finale.

Waahhhh! Its over now for months and months. Whatever will I do?

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS


told D it was she whom he loved and in his eloquent way of saying I'm sorry

The thing is, I don't think he ever really said sorry and asked for her forgiveness. In one scene he said, "I take no pride in my visit to her." And in the final "apology" scene he said that Demelza was his real, abiding love.

In that earlier scene, he also asked her, "How long will it take for you to forgive me?" I wanted her to ask right back, "How long will it take for you to ask for my forgiveness?"

I would have liked it if their reconciliation had come sooner in the episode, so that we could have gotten a longer, more convincing reconciliation scene. As it is, although Demelza is moved to tears in the reconciliation scene, she still doesn't look completely mollified in the final, cliffside scene. She still appears to have a slightly resentful expression in her eyes.

(And BTW, what is up with that? After reconciling at home, they then walked all the way over to Hendrawna Cliff to kiss and hug?)

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

I believe that Debbie read our thread about cliff metaphors and did not want to let us down, so she told Aiden, Eleanor, makeup, and the rest of the crew that they needed one final scene overlooking the breaking, roaring waves.

I wonder if gave them an opportunity to draw a cliff location from a hat or if she was just going for height, sound, and fury to encapsulate her vision of a happy, deep, and lasting memory for us, the adoring, sometimes confused, fans.

This response is written in irony, not sarcasm; And there are clear differences in each. In Series One and in most of Series Two, Demelza has been the Queen of Irony. At the end, Debbie recast her character as one who could outstrip George in the verbal cutting, slashing, and biting as a savant at sarcasm. She had been a beaten teen when Ross adopted her and her ironic responses to him were always a delight, yet never hurtful as in these past episodes.

Although I have not seen anything past E6, it is obvious that Debbie's quest to keep Demelza front and center as a lead and as a strong woman is seriously misguided in its interpretation of what strong means. A woman of that time - which is why I have watched this second coming of Ross Poldark - would not verbally abuse her spouse.

She ought not to sound so much like a person from Real Housewives. Could Debbie be so seduced by the dark side of fame that she has lost a bit of clarity about why Demelza / Eleanor have become such a hit with the fans? For me, Mrs. Ross's strength has been her ability to kind, faithful, enduring, and firm enough so that even the dunderheads in her household knew when enough was enough. All three of them, including Prudie. Without becoming an utter screw. Yelling and verbal cutting that leaves blood on the floor are two different things altogether.

I believe this is all about Debbie reading too much Twitter. And, yes, faithful participants: perhaps she has read too much IMDb also!





A Checkered Life speaks of myriad diverse adventures being the rewards of endless curiosity.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS


(And BTW, what is up with that? After reconciling at home, they then walked all the way over to Hendrawna Cliff to kiss and hug?)


Ha! I wondered about this odd transition too, lol.

As for the rest, maybe we're not supposed to think that all is hunky dory with Demelza yet. She's taken Ross' less than perfect olive branch meaning she's willing to give the marriage another chance but that doesn't mean that the hurt is resolved or that her trust in Ross is restored. That sort of stuff takes time. Perhaps the plan is to let this hopeful but still wary Demelza carry over into season 3...and perhaps make the VHT more possible. Just spitballing here.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Ladies,

I know that VHT has been explained; yet, everytime I see the letters I am reading Very Hot Thing!!

Surely not again so soon . . . . !!

What a difference forty years and the Internet + the World Wide Web has done to our thinking. I was far younger and sheltered (obviously) from the heat that rises between people.

Now the world crowds in via cyberspace changing our former pedestrian minds in ways not imagined.





A Checkered Life speaks of myriad diverse adventures being the rewards of endless curiosity.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

I found the following paragraph's in yesterday's The Cult Box thread and wanted to get opinions about the writer describing Ross's behavior:


Not content with smoothing out troubles in Trenwith, he finally sorts out his own troubles at home, and has a conversation with Demelza he should’ve had ages ago.

‘My arrogance, my idiocy, has been spectacular,’ he admits. Hey, no arguments there. But if Poldark teaches us anything, it’s that there’s nothing that a good apology and a hug atop a cliff can’t solve.


The Cult Box reviews are normally hilarious and I do not look for anything serious in reading them; however, this bit stopped me immediately because of the difference in how most people understand action involved with forgiveness.

So, I have reread some of the threads and see what has been nagging at me, which is how expectation and need occur in relationships. If we believe that Ross has not apologized to Demelza, I think that we are saying something separate than if we believe - or not - that Ross is profoundly sorry for hurting her.

To be able to obtain the formula that we want in having Ross say a set of words that will unlock our pain and allow us to release it to love again, we may have to wait a long time. Or, we can shorten the time by proving him with a better written script than Debbie did.

When we look at ourselves, do we hold ourselves to such a tight, specific manner of addressing our offences to people we love? In March I hurt some people that I loved in a very serious way, yet there was not a gram of malice involved. It is too long a story to share and afterward (a situation that left me exhausted and feeling discouraged for months), I began to understand what happened. As in most human interactions, intense feelings can take us to the edges of cliffs over which we accidentally fall. Perhaps it is only a few feet to a safe place or perhaps it is bone-crunching; either way, we are terrified for a matter of time.

In my situation, I was asked "why?" and I could not explain myself well or completely because it would implicate another person negatively. I simply could not do it and took the loss on myself. What happened in a way feels similar to how Ross had been blindsided by Elizabeth at that dinner.

Whether or not she meant to stir the pot, she proved a savant-in-ignorance. It was brilliant. I sat there stunned at the writing, the timing, the devastation in tossing out HOPE like an invisible gossamer web composed of tiny titanium links. He will never be free of her now. In the months after TBD (The Bad Decision), Ross feels like ---- and knows that he has -------- more than anything ever, but he cannot say Liz ensnared me.

Debbie writes him into a corner and finally provides the couple dozen words that are heart breaking. We know that he is profoundly sorry because we see his distress, hear the pain, and feel his truth. But DH does not give him the ritual words that will sound like he's asking permission to be forgiven. So, when can forgiveness occur if the formula is not exact?

It was striking to me that the man writing the Cult Box was absolutely clear that Ross had confessed his wrong against Demelza and apologized. If it were the people you loved as much as Demelza love Ross, would you reach out to begin the healing?


A Checkered Life speaks of myriad diverse adventures being the rewards of endless curiosity.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Very ingsightful A-checkered-life, There is a lot of truth in your observations.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Thank you, Nmadura. I always appreciate a lot your comments also.

There are quite a number of people on this board who share thoughtful, fascinating, sometime provocative comments that it is always interesting and a pleasure to read. It is also enjoyable because there are regular contributors who are bringing a masculine perspective demonstrating that we are often very similar in our thinking. This is quite interesting because it is all about the show and its components: story, actors, locations, etc.

From 2012 until Spring 2015 I was a regular on Benedict Cumberbatch's board, which was different from the boards focused on his separate projects, like Sherlock or a movie. It was specific to him as a person, although his most current endeavor was a large part of the day's conversation. From the moment is was obvious he was interested in Sophie Hunter there was a division like lightening striking Jane Eyre's tree. It was hardly believable that a significant number of women declared it was all a publicity stunt. Things became increasingly bizarre between the groups and I left. That group became a separate unit someplace else; even now, with his second child coming, they persist.

But then, who am I to talk after spending five years of my involved with Star Trek fandom, conventions, costumes, etc.? I might not have wanted to beam aboard any version of the Enterprise, but playing war games in the park and doing other silly things were a great escape from long hours on the job.It never crossed my mind that Spock might have been involved with Uhura during those days.

Recently, I have thought of joining the local Sherlock Holmes group. Have you ever been involved directly in a fan group? I wonder if others on the board have ever participated in cosplay and conventions. If so, which ones and why?





A Checkered Life speaks of myriad diverse adventures being the rewards of endless curiosity.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS


There are quite a number of people on this board who share thoughtful, fascinating, sometime provocative comments that it is always interesting and a pleasure to read. It is also enjoyable because there are regular contributors who are bringing a masculine perspective demonstrating that we are often very similar in our thinking


It is a very civil discussion board and I greatly appreciate it. Most of my friends are tolerant of my Poldark obsession but don't share my enthusiasm. And you're right, one of the most thoughtful and knowledgeable is from a male contributor.


Have you ever been involved directly in a fan group
?

I'm a lurker on the Tolkien sites. LOTR is one of my all time favorite books from when I read it in High School (1970s) and have read it more times than I can count. I have a rather large bookshelf filled with Tolkien, his numerous books, literary criticism, companion works, and those related to the films. I don't directly participate in the on line fandom and have never been to conventions, not that I haven't thought of it, though.

I do actively participate in a very small TV series fandom. The show was called Alias Smith and Jones, which aired in the early 1970s when I was a preteen. It is one of the first TV shows that I watched religiously and probably one of my first preteen celebrity crushes. In the mid 2000s I rediscovered a VHS tape of the pilot in the bargain bin of the supermarket and in a burst of nostalgia bought it. It held up well over time and with my growing familiarity of the internet became aware of online fandoms and all that goes with it i.e. message boards, fanfiction, social gatherings.

ASJ fandom, while small has a significant number of UK members. Some of the people I have met through ASJ online have become actual social acquaintances in RL. Dinners and weekend trips have been undertaken. There was one western vacation, with an ASJ themed itinerary, which a Denver based member arranged, that had people (ASJ fans and family members) join from the UK and all over the US. I have joined one or two boards and have even written a few ASJ fanfiction stories(mostly under the name Nell McKeon). I feel vaguely embarrassed or silly sometimes about it but the fans are friendly, funny, supportive of writing or artistic efforts, accepting and it's an occasional leisure activity. My family groans and makes fun of me but are amusingly tolerant.

I mostly participate to have the ability to discuss a topic/subject/fandom that interests me in which I have no other direct outlet to engage in.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS


But DH does not give him the ritual words that will sound like he's asking permission to be forgiven. So, when can forgiveness occur if the formula is not exact?


Good question. I think the answer is that it would depend on each individual person to decide for themselves.

I'm just surprised that the show writers, who, by the nature of their profession, know the importance of words, would make a deliberate choice to not have Ross say "I'm sorry" or "Forgive me" - especially when the exact words already exist in the source material. There has to be a reason for this choice and I'm very curious to know what it is.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Thanks, Gveronica.

My issue with DH is the conflict in her attitude about the source materials: the books and Oldark. It sounds like she clearly had not read the books, does not want to be influenced by the first version, yet is drifting further away from some crucial elements in the current saga as she is (seemingly) influenced by the clamor of enthusiastic followers.

Or, perhaps I am completely forgetful in what I saw in first series, read in the books, and rewatched after purchasing the first series when it came out on VHS?

Nahhhhhhhhhhhhh.





A Checkered Life speaks of myriad diverse adventures being the rewards of endless curiosity.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS


The thing is, I don't think he ever really said sorry and asked for her forgiveness. In one scene he said, "I take no pride in my visit to her." And in the final "apology" scene he said that Demelza was his real, abiding love.



No, I know he didn't actually say those words. I meant he said them in his own way (that was what I meant) in the best way at that moment he could, in what was coming to his mind at that particular time. I mean we just can't have our cake and eat it too know what I mean? We all wanted him to do the apology speech and I cannot deny he did a great speech. But now it seems people aren't happy because he didn't actually say the exact words they wanted him to say. I was just so happy he said what he said...finally he saw the light! Do any of us ever say the right words at the time we are fumbling for the right words? Know why? Because we are fumbling. Often we tend to leave the one thing out we really should have said. We walk away later and go "how could I forget to say that"? But to me what was important is the context of what he did say to her. She listened and it was at least enough to keep her there and not leave. Ross is not the best communicator. I'm not either, I'm not good with spoken words (and partly why I sometimes don't get into the long discussions on here-most of you are much more eloquent than myself with your writing). I guess I can kind of understand.


I would have liked it if their reconciliation had come sooner in the episode, so that we could have gotten a longer, more convincing reconciliation scene. As it is, although Demelza is moved to tears in the reconciliation scene, she still doesn't look completely mollified in the final, cliffside scene. She still appears to have a slightly resentful expression in her eyes


I agree about wanting it coming a bit sooner and having a longer reconciliation but I didn't much expect it either. But it doesn't mean I wasn't hopeful. LOL! Nah I didn't really see the resentment in D's eyes at the end. I saw relief though and perhaps a little silent joy. Funny how we can all see something different.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Yes, this is exactly what I meant, TLF! Thank you.

When the cost is high in relationships, communication can be extremely difficult. Even in ordinary times there can be misunderstandings if people are in different emotional places.

Over the years I have felt that it is easier for some people to say whatever is on their minds when they are "speaking" on the Web to others. No one knows the place of origin or even if the language is first, second, or third for people involved.

On some boards, like this one, people can disagree and people are almost always respectful. On others I have visited, it can be very risky to state anything that is not the approved rhetoric. One can be verbally eviscerated because respect - that golden bird - has left the nest for places unknown. People suited up like Iron Man do well enough, but others tread lightly or leave.

It might be easier if we all had the same exact language and were all programmed to know the exact meaning of each word, so there could be no misunderstandings. Probably, that would last an instant in time until two minutes later someone wanted this or that work to have a different meaning. Or, because it was "SOoooooooo boring!"

The struggles to understand - I believe - are what give us richness in our lives, develop character, and create layers of memories that bind us. Don't you think? Those are the times we remember and cherish. Like Joseph mentioned, a broken bone will always be stronger at the break.

If Ross and Demelza were real people, I could only say that they have done their best given their histories. Having stayed alive through a bloody, savage war, facing starvation, etc., because of a dream of first love kept you going is not exactly like your high school sweetheart and the worst trials were quarterly finals. We cannot compare our experiences with those of Ross or any veteran of war.

My hope is that the cast and crew get some downtime to revisit their own lives and rest. Or not, if they have already begun again.





A Checkered Life speaks of myriad diverse adventures being the rewards of endless curiosity.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS


My hope is that the cast and crew get some downtime to revisit their own lives and rest. Or not, if they have already begun again.


No rest for the wicked, as they say - filming is well under way for Season 3, which is reported to be televised in the UK Spring, so April/May next year or thereabouts

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

I have loved films since I was five years old, so a long time; even before colored television. When I was in high school, I would work on scenery for plays and loved the magic of happened when friends disappeared into their characters. Acting has always been magic.

Later I had friends who got into the business and even played a small part in an amateur short film that won an award at a local festival. It was interesting, but nothing I could imagine doing. However, life is greatly enriched by the stories that are made and told via film, whether shown on the small or large screens.

The very fact that so many thoughtful, interesting, well-spoken people show up here for a shared community time with others about a TV series is a marvel.

And, please, let me say THANK YOU to all who have been (unknowingly) distracting me from the countdown on today's election. The polls close here on the North West Coast in 33 minutes, BUT Alaska and Hawaii are going to be open for a while afterward.

My anxiety, like a couple hundred million of my fellow Americans, is that this is only the beginning of the end: either way. If she wins, he will demand a recount. If he wins, life as we know it will be midnight for 1500+ days. If she wins, the Republicans will try to impeach her. So many ifs . . . . .

Oh, well. Life can only be lived a moment at a time and never in advance of that moment.




A Checkered Life speaks of myriad diverse adventures being the rewards of endless curiosity.

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS


When the cost is high in relationships, communication can be extremely difficult. Even in ordinary times there can be misunderstandings if people are in different emotional places


You hit the nail on the head....very true and most definitely in the case of Ross and Demelza.


Over the years I have felt that it is easier for some people to say whatever is on their minds when they are "speaking" on the Web to others.


You are so right. Its too easy sometimes don't you think if you now what I mean? In the last several years in my experiences on the web, especially with message boards and comment boards, much rationale and courtesy goes out the window and many say EXACTLY what they would not to a person's face, some horrible things. This board is my last board to actually stay apart of. All others on the IMDB eventually went pear-shaped and I moved on.


The struggles to understand - I believe - are what give us richness in our lives, develop character, and create layers of memories that bind us. Don't you think? Those are the times we remember and cherish


I totally agree..it takes awhile to get there sometimes, much growing pains if you will, but yes creates more lasting relationships and memories we may otherwise not have to bind us as you said. It is many, if not most, times through our mistakes, some of our biggest ones, that we can learn the most about ourselves and can develop richer character. Without mistakes, how can we ever learn what we might not have otherwise? Even if sometimes those mistakes can be detrimental to some.


If Ross and Demelza were real people, I could only say that they have done their best given their histories


I think so too. It is so easy to watch from afar and ask "what on earth was he thinking" or "why does she keep reacting like that, she should just leave him"? To make judgements when we are not in that situation, maybe never have been, doesn't work. When someone has become part of us or part of our lives, the answer is never ever simple or easy.

You are very wise checkered...and very eloquent too. Glad you are here!

Re: They've only gone and done it! (S2 finale) SPOILERS

Thanks, TLF. I am very glad to be here and being able to join in. It has been fun.

Any wisdom I have comes for my failures far more than from my successes, yet I am very grateful for both. We moved constantly because my father was in the military. It was often an extremely challenging thing to enter as new culture, sometimes with a new language as a shy, introverted child. Sometimes immersion is the best way, even if you have to struggle because you learn to "just get on with it".

Over the years I became socialized to the mobility and began to enjoy some of the adventures. It gave us an opportunity to become flexible in seeing life, being comfortable with people from different types of communities, attitudes, foods (the best part), and historical cultures. History became very important in understanding people and the places we lived. It definitely broadened my mind and thinking.

When you spend time in watching and listening to people who seem very different to you in the beginning, you can often end up (a couple years later) thinking that you can't see any differences at all. It is simply because any fear has been let go and the hearts and minds are open. Most people want to be treated in the ways they would treat their best friends.

Like you, I have left IMDb boards due to the lack of civility. Respect is crucial to civilization and without it, we revert to being barbarians. It is fascinating to see how it is built and grows when nurtured; then, all things seem possible.

That is why I have been enjoying this board. People are interested in sharing deeply from different sides and that provokes new ideas, interesting comments, and really funny humor. The cliff thread is a solid example.





A Checkered Life speaks of myriad diverse adventures being the rewards of endless curiosity.
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