Star Wars: The Force Awakens : Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

I'm sure you read my posting above listing how we've seen different abilities in each movie. I interpret it that The Force seems to be something that is ever evolving - which is pretty much the only way I can justify the stupidity of the Jedi/Sith being able to do things in the different trilogies that they don't do in the others.

From how they built the Star Wars movies, The Force seems to be something that impacts individuals differently. Midichlorian counts also play a significant part in how much power a Jedi has. The closes comparison I can make from our world is to use musicians as an example. There are many people in the world who can play guitar. Then you have those, for whatever reason, can just play the guitar better than others. Much like with Force users, they were able to harness their power differently to become more powerful and stand out from other musicians...this sounds so stupid of a comparison but it's the best I can do.

You brought up a great point about Yoda. I will point to the movies themselves for an answer. As we know from the canon, Anakin had a higher Midichlorian count than Yoda. That means he had potential to become a more powerful Jedi Master than Yoda ever was. That Midichlorian count would be transferred to Anakin's lineage, so both Leia and her child (Kylo) would have that power passed down to them from The Chosen One.

Being the grandchild of The Chosen One is the only way I can make "sense" of Kylo having as much power as he has. In the end, it's all made up BS and is pretty nonsensical anyway.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!


Yoda, despite nearly 900 years experience with the force, cannot stop a laser blast in mid air (which Episode III showed) so how can someone like Kylo Ren whose training isn't even complete do it?


Yoda CANNOT, or DID NOT?

I'm more than sure the scene was included because it was freakin' cool.
After that, I'm sure that they used the scene to establish that Kylo was a pretty powerful bloke.
I'm even willing to consider that the amount of consideration to what had or had not been shown before wasn't very much.
But I'd also like to point out that it is NOT inconsistent with what had been shown before.

The fact that we actually see the discreet blaster bolts as they fly from the blaster to the target is enough to declare that they do NOT travel at ludicrous speed. We already know that powerful Force-wielders are able to anticipate the firing event of a weapon and respond accordingly (to block the bold with their lightsaber, hand... move out of the way... whatever). We also already know that Force-wielding characters can move objects.

So, why is it unreasonable for a powerful Force-wielding character to anticipate the shot, and respond by either blocking it with lightsaber or hand, step out of the way, force-move something (or somebody else) into the bolt's path... or to simply arrest the bolt mid-flight? Sure, we've never seen it done, but I can't think of anything that's been established that suggests that it couldn't be done - not only by Kylo but by others as well.

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Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

I agree that stopping energy in mid air is indeed impossible according to Star Wars lore. They should have had Kylo redirect the energy bolt or absorb it. That would have been energy manipulation consistant with the use of Force Lightning [which is also energy manipulation].

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!


I agree that stopping energy in mid air is indeed impossible according to Star Wars lore.


Why?


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Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

Freezing energy in mid air without stopping time is weird. And it is something never seen in Star Wars lore. And even in other fantasy universes the freezing of energy in mid air is quite illogical and never occurs.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

The Force is illogical.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

Exactly. All of the stuff in Star Wars is just made up BS.

The abilities of Force users has expanded/changed over the course of the franchise. Each movie shows new abilities. I don't think Kylo being able to do that is anymore insane than Jedi being able to Force Speed down a corridor or Jedi gymnastic fighting.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

I disagree, we see an expansion on abilities already known, there were no new abilities in the PT, technically. It's just all intuition/reaction enhancement, telekinesis, and force lightning. What new abilities were introduced?

Detailed mind reading is absolutely a new ability showcased in TFA.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!


there were no new abilities in the PT, technically.


Actually, there were. A lot of them. I'm copying and pasting from my first response within this thread:

- Episode 1 alone introduced Jedi Speed-Running (or Force Speed), Force Jump, double-ended lightsabers, the user only needing one hand to fight with a lightsaber, Force Meld, Force Push, and The Rule of 2.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

A double ended lightsabre is not a force-power. Using the force to boost yourself would just be another form of telekinesis. Force Push is another form of telekinesis. Force Meld?

The rule of two is simply an expansion of the Sith, not a new ability.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

Double ended lightsaber built off of the mythos of Star Wars and introduced a new kind of lightsaber. If you look at my first response within this thread on page 1, you will see that's what I was talking about (I even told you I copy + pasted from my original response). The Star Wars franchise has always built and shown new abilities and mythos in regards to The Force in each Star Wars movie.

Force Push is something we had never seen before the PT. It was a new ability. The same applies to Force Speed, Force Jump, and Force users using only one hand on a lightsaber.

Force Meld is when Qui-Gon cuts ("melds") through the door inside the Trade Federation ship. I don't really like the name but that's what they call it.

Again, the rule of two builds on the the concept of The Force and introduced new ideas. All of the Star Wars movies have done it too. I broke down how all the different movies show new abilities if you look at my original response.

Having Kylo show new abilities isn't out of ordinary for the Star Wars franchise. Some people are only making a big deal about it because they hate the movie. It's fine if people hate it, but at least people shouldn't be hypocrites when it comes to chastising what is essentially Star Wars traditions.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

Force push is not a new ability. It's a different application of an ability we'd already seen.

Force Meld? Seriously? He was melting the door with his sabre...was that not clear to you? If you look up Force Meld, it's actually something that they do in EU books...so not sure where you got your info.

Having Kylo do something that is previously not possible, is out of the ordinary. Then having Rey do it, is even more so.

Think about telekinesis, it's moving objects with your mind...why is pushing someone any different? If you can move objects, you can push them. We saw this in the OT. We saw Luke use the force to enhance his jumping, which is still telekinesis. Through this same ability, you could propel yourself fast, in a straight line. It's not a leap, it's pretty simple.

TFA is the first movie to show us a new ability. It was mind reading. Using force-telekinesis you can not only manipulate matter, but also energy. Kylo does the latter with the blaster. Granted, we'd already seen Vader sort of do this, and in the PT Yoda does it with force-lightning.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

I don't have a dog in the fight or horse in the race. I'm not going to fight technicalities with you. If it hasn't been talked about or shown in a prior movie, it's new. That's one really good thing about each of the episodes (especially the PT), they built on the world and gave us new stuff. It was never the same old stuff.


Think about telekinesis, it's moving objects with your mind...why is pushing someone any different? If you can move objects, you can push them. We saw this in the OT. We saw Luke use the force to enhance his jumping, which is still telekinesis. Through this same ability, you could propel yourself fast, in a straight line. It's not a leap, it's pretty simple.


Before Episode 1, we had never seen a character exact their will on someone by Force Pushing him/her. Unless you can point to a specific scene from Episodes 4-6 where a character Force Pushed someone, then it was new when the PT came along.

The closes we came to seeing anything like that in the prior movies was when Vader used the Force to throw objects at Luke. He didn't however Force Push Luke. Moving an inanimate object and another Force user are two different concepts entirely. One has a will and powers to fight back. The other is just a lifeless object with no abilities.

Yup. Force Meld. Breaking through a door using a lightsaber was something we had never seen before. It isn't very exciting but it was new nonetheless. I don't know where you looked, but there's a lot of misinformation on the Internet.


Having Kylo do something that is previously not possible, is out of the ordinary. Then having Rey do it, is even more so.

Where was it stated it wasn't possible? Point to a scene in Episodes 1-6 where a character says blaster fire cannot be stopped mid air by a character using The Force. If you can, I will admit I was wrong. If not, then don't throw around statements you can't back up. I only care about what is actually in the movies. The movies are the Star Wars gospel.


TFA is the first movie to show us a new ability.

You should watch Episode 1-6 again then. There are plenty of new abilities and concepts introduced throughout the series in regards to Force users and The Force in general. I will copy and paste the full breakdown as I stated in my original posting on page 1:

- Episode 4 introduced The Force, lightsabers being very heavy requiring two hands to wield, Jedi mind trick, Force Choke, and Force Sight.

- Episode 5 introduced telekinesis/being able to throw objects around using The Force, a non-Jedi being able to use a lightsaber, a faster paced lightsaber fight, reflecting blaster fire with a hand, telepathy, levitation, and Force Vision.

- Episode 6 really introduced Jedi gymnastic fighting (although the fight on Cloud City w/ Vader/Luke could count for Episode 5), Force Lightning, being able to reflect blaster power with a lightsaber, and Sith having yellow eyes.

- Episode 1 introduced Jedi Speed-Running (or Force Speed), Force Jump, double-ended lightsabers, the user only needing one hand to fight with a lightsaber, Force Meld, Force Push, and The Rule of 2.

- Episode 2 introduced the curved hilt to a lightsaber and whatever ability Yoda uses to jump around/fight at his advanced age (I don't know if there's an actual title for that skill).

Episode 3 built on the idea of Force Visions and actually showed us some of those visions through Anakin's nightmares.

Now Episode 7 has introduced being able to stop blaster fire mid air. I'm sure Episode 8 will bring something new to the table as well. It's just what happens with Star Wars movies.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

You're just using the wrong words. They weren't new abilities. They're just expanding on abilities we'd only seen through Luke, who was a bit of a novice


Yup. Force Meld. Breaking through a door using a lightsaber was something we had never seen before. It isn't very exciting but it was new nonetheless. I don't know where you looked, but there's a lot of misinformation on the Internet.



No, it's just using a lightsabre. This wasn't using the force, it was just a light sabre. Wookiepedia mentions the Force Meld as referenced in the EU, where multiple force users combine minds.

Your list sounds a lot like one a child might make...not a knock, but it's like you didn't use any reasoning when you made it. Most of the abilities were shown in ANH/ESB. Force lightning being the only thing we hadn't seen, but it's just an extension of control over the force, which is energy.

Again, I don't agree with you, and I think you should reconsider saying these are "abilities"...telekinesis with the force is responsible for most of what we see the Jedi/Sith do. The outstanding items are enhanced intuition/feeling/reflexes and enhanced ESP: sensing emotions.

Episode 7 introduced detailed mind reading, which was never an ability before. It's the first film to show us a new ability since ESB outside of lightning in ROTJ.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!


Your list sounds a lot like one a child might make...not a knock, but it's like you didn't use any reasoning when you made it.

I didn't create the content in the movies. I only broke down what was new in each movie. That was the reasoning. Some of the names are silly but it was a series intended for young people, so the names are appropriate to the demographic. I did not name the abilities either. If I was the writer on any of the movies, I would have tried for something a little more creative and less...gimmicky.


Again, I don't agree with you, and I think you should reconsider saying these are "abilities".


Vader calls them "skills" in the OT. Does that sparkle for you?


Episode 7 introduced detailed mind reading, which was never an ability before.

The Emperor actually reads Luke like a book in Return of the Jedi. Vader is also able to penetrate his mind and find out about Leia.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

You broke down new things we saw, but they aren't new abilities. They're expanded capabilities of mostly one specific ability.

Vader saying skills doesn't disprove what I'm saying.

What exactly does the Emperor say? He senses Lukes emotions, I don't recall anything else...Vader doesn't penetrate Luke's mind, he reads Lukes emotions, and makes conclusions. The novelization explained it as Luke crying out for Leia when she was shot, saying 'sister' similar to when he said 'father' to Vader through the force.

Even if Vader did read a specific thought, sister is quite vague, Kylo and Rey exhibit abilities in their mind reading that we'd never before seen.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!


You broke down new things we saw, but they aren't new abilities. They're expanded capabilities of mostly one specific ability.

This conversation is becoming very tedious...

If they're new things we've never seen before in a Star Wars movie, they're new abilities within the franchise. I don't know how you don't see that, but I'm not going to spend anymore time on this particular subject. We'll just move on.


Vader saying skills doesn't disprove what I'm saying.

I didn't say it did. I was offering a synonym because you seemed to have a problem with "abilities" being used.


What exactly does the Emperor say? He senses Lukes emotions, I don't recall anything else

The Emperor has long sequence with Luke. I don't see the point of transcribing what is said. It sounds like a waste of my time. I would recommend you just watch the movie.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

Maybe you're not getting this...It's ALL telekinesis. Moving things, moving yourself, it's all telekinesis. If you can't draw conclusions from that, and recognize that what you see are simply different applications of the same ability, then you shouldn't have made this topic.

Skill is different all together. It's a measure of proficiency.

Here's some quotes from the scene with the emperor, directly from the script:

Luke is in torment. He glances at his lightsaber sitting on the armrest
of the throne. The Emperor watches him and smiles, touches the
lightsaber.

He doesn't read his mind there...he saw the glance...


EMPEROR
Good. I can feel your anger. I am defenseless. Take your weapon!
Strike me down with all your hatred, and your journey towards the dark
side will be complete.


Not here either.

http://www.imsdb.com/scripts/Star-Wars-Return-of-the-Jedi.html

Mind pointing out where the Emperor reads Luke's mind?

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!


then you shouldn't have made this topic.

I didn't.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

Shouldn't have replied?

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

Well, you finally said something new. I thought I would honor that.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

You're right about the Emperor and Luke. I always thought he read Luke's inner turmoil but it's purely a surface read (for lack of better words). Even when he reads Anakin in Episode 3, it's purely emotion he can feel.

We'll have to add that new ability to the Episode 7 list.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

Having lasers and light behave like lightsabers and the 'spokes' of the Death Star's main laser blast? I'm willing to give this a pass and suspend my disbelief that far.

Take it you're not?

--End Transmission: Code 350--

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

That's why the writing in this film is so mentally challenged.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

The whole point was so that Jar Jar Abrams would be able to close in on the laser bolt and use his patented Lens Flare Crap (TM) on it. Notice how, aside from the two Star Trek reboot movies he directed, this laser bolt is the ONLY time he uses Lens Flare Crap (TM) in the ENTIRETY of TFA? Someone should ban this idiot from directing, if he's going to fill movies with such superficial crap like Lens Flare Crap (TM).

Why are you here if you haven't seen the movie yet?

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

As far as I know, Luke at one point in SW lore sort of controlled a black hole and made it collapse into itself.

This takes way, way more energy than freezing a light beam in mid air.




I'm the guy who makes the "worst movie ever" thread in your favorite movie board

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

It's definitely a ridiculous thing to throw in there, primarily because they then spend the rest of the movie trying to establish that Ren is still in need of a lot of training. If someone like Snoke were to have done that it might have worked better.

____
the bells shall ring in gladness at the mountain kings return

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!


It's definitely a ridiculous thing to throw in there


Is it? Look at what Anakin could do with no training in Episode 1. He was 9/10 years old when could see things before they happened and could pilot a pod racer (something no human was believed to be able to do).

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

As much as I find TFA to be garbage, I don't find this stunt that big of a leap to believe. The force is energy, and if you can influence it, why would you not be able to hold other energy in place? The only thing that's ridiculous is the physics...why would the bolt still have momentum after being stopped? Unless Kylo pushed it along its path.

Re: Nobody can stop a laser blast with the force!

This was one of the main reasons why this movie was a joke.
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