Star Wars: Episode VII - The Force Awakens : Rey has no.personality

Re: Rey has no.personality

You make up your own facts to promote a false narrative.

Re: Rey has no.personality

You are making up a false narrative of Rey and Finn being even comparable in terms of being rescued by refusing to acknowledge that Finn needed rescue at Maz's. Can't you see and admit that?

Re: Rey has no.personality


You are making up a false narrative of Rey and Finn being even comparable in terms of being rescued by refusing to acknowledge that Finn needed rescue at Maz's. Can't you see and admit that?


Han and Chewie needed rescuing in that scene as well, and Finn needed rescuing because he purposely put himself in danger by staying behind. Also, Han and Chewie needed rescuing when those gangs were about to kill them. Heroic people would likely be more often in need of saving because they run toward danger. In the end, Finn's heroism saved countless lives, but that doesn't count for anything with you because you can't see past his race/gender.

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Star Wars generally doesn't do "damsels in distress". Luke at least was working on it and trying to overcome the problem and asked for and received help when he needed it. Even Leia being captured in ANH was treated very respectfully and she came across well.
Leia was on Death Row. Because she was a princess, they needed the approval of someone not on the Death Star before they could proceed with the execution. In hindsight, I would guess it's Palpatine.


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Re: Rey has no.personality

I dunno if I believe that. Tarkin was given authority over the Death Star and seemingly over Vader himself. She wasn't initially to be harmed but after she lied to them and refused to reveal the rebels location, Tarkin ordered her to be eliminated and I think everyone there would follow his orders. They must simply be inefficient and they hadn't gotten around to executing her yet, even though Tarkin said "immediately". I doubt the trooper he gave the order to went behind his back to ask the emperor if it was ok.

Re: Rey has no.personality


Tarkin was given authority over the Death Star and seemingly over Vader himself.

You are right in everything (including your talk with Ruby) but this that I quote.

What we see in Star Wars (ANH) is something that most viewers fail to understand: a dual chain of command.

Tarkin is the commander of the Death Star. As such, he has absolute authority over it. And as such, he is the equivalent of a Fleet Admiral or Grand Admiral in major Earth navies.

Vader is the Emperor's envoy. He is akin to a political commissar in actual, historical Earth navies such as those of Revolutionary France or the Soviet Union: a representative of the regime.

Under normal circumstances, the political commissar will not interefere with the commander of the vessel and its operations. But as the representative of the regime, he has ultimately the authority to overrule said commander if deemed necessary.

Admittedly, in Star Wars (ANH) it may be difficult to see this: it's the details that reveal it. Vader never asks for Tarkin's permission to leave, for instance, as any subordinate officer would have to or be severely reprimanded.

Not Vader: Vader comes and goes exactly as he pleases on board the Death Star. He is never dismissed: he takes his leave when it suits him.

And note that Vader has no military rank: he is Lord Vader. He is not an executive officer, he is outside the formal hierarchy of the Imperial Fleet altogether. He is the envoy of the Emperor, not an officer. In military parlance, he is essentially an asset on detached duty with extreme authority.

In the daily running of the Death Star, Vader will "obey" Tarkin, as any political commissar would. But should Tarkin go against the doctrine of the regime, Vader would terminate Tarkin's command on the spot. As any political commissar would.

In the scene where Tarkin and Vader comment on letting the Millennium Falcon escape, this dual command structure is evident. This is not a Grand Admiral discussing with one of his officers: it's two men with different authorities and responsibilities altogether. Tarkin commands the Death Star. Vader commands what he pleases.

This is of course made explicit in ESB; but it's there too in Star Wars (ANH), in the details.

Re: Rey has no.personality

I agree with your assessment of their roles. I never thought Vader was actually a regular member of the military in the same sense that Tarkin was. When I said Tarkin was seemingly given authority over Vader, I was largely just thinking of the scene when Vader was choking a commander who disrespected him. Tarkin gives an order to Vader, I think he said "Enough of this, Vader, release him" and Vader obeys, releases him, and says "as you wish" or something similar.

It's so unusual seeing someone other than the Emperor giving orders to Vader and having Vader clearly respect him and obey with how big a character Vader has become since that first movie.

And the tiny fact that Tarkin gets the tall chair at the table and Vader gets a regular one suggests superiority over Vader. But yes, I do think that Vader was not actually under obligation to obey Tatkin's command and could have gotten away with it if he kept choking that guy if he really wanted to.

Re: Rey has no.personality


And the tiny fact that Tarkin gets the tall chair at the table and Vader gets a regular one suggests superiority over Vader.


Ah, but your memory fails you, my friend!

Tarkin "gets the tall chair at the table" because that is the chair of the Commanding Officer of the Death Star.

But Vader doesn't sit at all: he stands next to Tarkin. This is exactly to show that Vader is an extraneous element altogether: he has, literally, no place among them. He is an outsider.

As such, it is obvious that Lord Vader falls outside the authority of Tarkin.

And note also: the very fact that Vader can begin to choke a senior officer of the Death Star, without any form of authorization, and without being reprimanded in the slightest by Tarkin afterwards, just shows what extreme authority he has.

And Vader "obeys" Tarkin on that occasion because he just as well might: he had made his point quite clear!

Re: Rey has no.personality

That's interesting. I had not thought about the dual chain of command, which makes Vader kind of a commissar (except that he'd be a commissar to himself).


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Re: Rey has no.personality

I am guessing you are not a man that has ever had to defend anyone. Having a someone hold your hand does not increase your speed or reaction or ability to defend someone as much as having 2 hands. Honestly if a scared women is in your care nothing compares to being able to throw her and beat down the threat with 2 hands.

Strangely the movies seem to think a man in danger likes to hold hands as though it is easier to run and hold hands.

You may be an idiot, go check with someone.

Re: Rey has no.personality


I'm just pointing out the double standard.

Indeed, you are the very embodiment of double standards incarnate. This is why you project them so much.

Re: Rey has no.personality


I'm just pointing out the double standard.

The only double standard I see is that I try to honestly and politely adress your questions, but you don't try to adress mine.

You're not being fair, Ruby. So there is no point in continuing this conversation.

Re: Rey has no.personality

You guys want to point out the Mary Sueness in Rey, but get all butthurt when we do the same with Luke.

Re: Rey has no.personality

That is because there is no Mary Sueness in Luke and it is ridiculous and stupid every time you bring it up.

Re: Rey has no.personality

Not for nothing, but I really enjoyed reading this! The section about faith in the force is especially good.

Good luck with Ruby, but don't get your hopes up!

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Re: Rey has no.personality

You spelled Disney incorrectly. It's Disney. As in Disney Ridley.

Re: Rey has no.personality

She is flat.

Re: Rey has no.personality

So true.

Re: Rey has no.personality

There are legitimate criticisms about Rey. Not having a "personality" is not one of them.

Re: Rey has no.personality


...an emphasis on Daisy Ridley making cute or silly faces in ridiculous overacting.


This! I just watched the movie again, to see if it would get better watching it a second time, but it gets only worse. The overacting of Ridley, Boyega and to some extent also the other actors is really annoying and makes this movie very hard to watch for me. I love your signature btw., it is spot on! ;)

In my opinion the droids are the only well written / interesting characters in this movie.

Too bad the makers of this movie lacked true inspiration for a great story inside the Star Wars universe. Instead we get some recycled material from the original trilogy and Vader 2.0 with an all new voice engine... While we know that the real Vader cannot survive without his suit, the Vader 2.0 suit/mask just seems to be there without any purpose except to remind the viewer that there used to be a real Vader.

This movie doesn't have a spot in the imdb top 250.

Re: Rey has no.personality

Overacting would not result in such high ratings.

Re: Rey has no.personality

The ratings are for the movie alltogether not for the actor, try to understand the difference. The high ratings are the result of Star Wars, Han Solo + Leia + Chewbaca, Star Wars, the droids, Star Wars, some eye candy effects including lightsabers, the retro setting, oh and I almost forgot to mention the franchise Star Wars..

Re: Rey has no.personality


The ratings are for the movie alltogether not for the actor, try to understand the difference. The high ratings are the result of Star Wars, Han Solo + Leia + Chewbaca, Star Wars, the droids, Star Wars, some eye candy effects including lightsabers, the retro setting, oh and I almost forgot to mention the franchise Star Wars..


So the main characters had nothing to do with the ratings? Most of the screen time was taken up by Rey, Finn, Kylo Ren, and Poe. You can't separate them from the ratings. Fans loved them. In fact, two new characters to be introduced in VIII had their roles scaled down in order to give more time to these four.

Re: Rey has no.personality

I don't know wether they did or didn't factor into the ratings much. However if you take those two lead characters put them in a different setting and call the movie something other than Star Wars it would likely not get a high rating like this movie did.

I could ask you wether you think that the mediocre rating (6.6) of the movie "Focus" has anything to do with the two lead characters a black male played by Will Smith and a white female lead played by Margot Robbie, who I think are both great actors. My answer would be, that it does not have a significant influence on the rating. What very likely factored more into the rating is that many people don't like to see a white woman get romantically involved with a black man.

Re: Rey has no.personality

I thought all four of the new leading characters were great, had wonderful chemistry. Poe/Finn, Finn/Rey, Rey/Kylo Ren. Unfortunately, I think you're right that there are still racists out there who don't like seeing a black guy with a white woman. Shame because I love Rey and Finn together. I think the movie would have a higher user rating if racism and sexism didn't exist.

Re: Rey has no.personality

Or more like Focus was a very average movie at best. I'm surprised it got such a high rating and I like Will Smith a lot. I am more likely to watch a movie he is in.

Re: Rey has no.personality

Rey had all the personality of a plank of wood and is a character created just to meet a feminist agenda of having strong female leads but without a motor inside.

Re: Rey has no.personality


Rey had all the personality of a plank of wood and is a character created just to meet a feminist agenda of having strong female leads but without a motor inside.


Translation: My masculinity is butthurt over a kickass female lead protagonist in a SW movie.

No doubt you already hate Jyn.

Re: Rey has no.personality

Making Rey good at everything makes her a boring character and Jyn is most likely going to be a carbon copy of this Mary Sue archetype to continue this pathetic pc agenda.

Re: Rey has no.personality


Making Rey good at everything makes her a boring character and Jyn is most likely going to be a carbon copy of this Mary Sue archetype to continue this pathetic pc agenda.


Luke was also great at everything.

Re: Rey has no.personality

He failed at almost everything other than blowing up the first Death Star and redeeming his father.

Re: Rey has no.personality

That's blatantly false Ruby. He was a good pilot and a decent shot, that's about it. He was terrible at defending himself and often needed his friends to rescue him since they were better at fighting than he was

Re: Rey has no.personality

Shooting stormtroopers, saving the princess by swinging her over a deep chasm, piloting, and using the Force to destroy the Death Star. He also has mechanical abilities, and I'm sure he's good at water farming.

Re: Rey has no.personality


Shooting stormtroopers


Everyone was shooting stormtroopes and he missed a lot like everyone else. Rey is the only one that missed the first shot then never missed again.


saving the princess by swinging her over a deep chasm


Umm what is so special about that? Even I could do that.


piloting


yes an established pilot piloting a ship, the outrage. And he almost crashed and was shot down multiple times and did not even save himself a single time while flying because it was his first time piloting that type of fighter. Compared to Rey whom performed like a master the first time flying the falcoln, after a few bumps during take off.


using the Force to destroy the Death Star


umm he didn't use the force to destroy the death star, that was incidental. The force helped give him guidance of when to pull the trigger. The shot and chain reaction is what destroyed it. So everyone that was involved in getting the plans to the rebels and all the pilots involved in the attack destroyed the death star. Luke was only the final piece, nothing more.


He also has mechanical abilities


when in ANH did luke display any significant mechanical abilities? fixing C3PO? That was not even under pressure, that was calmly fixing while talking with Obi-Wan.


I'm sure he's good at water farming


I would certainly hope so, it is what his family survived off of. I would have no problem with Rey if all she was good at was scavenging.

Re: Rey has no.personality

This cracked me up, you could swing a princess over a deep chasm? Have you done that by yourself? Done it with a princess, done it with anyone before because that actually was a physically hard thing to do.

Re: Rey has no.personality


This cracked me up, you could swing a princess over a deep chasm? Have you done that by yourself? Done it with a princess, done it with anyone before because that actually was a physically hard thing to do.


Yes, the teenage farm boy does that and fights off stormtroopers with a blaster. Then he goes on to save the galaxy. Notice how easily he swung that grappling hook. But hey, he's a boy.

Re: Rey has no.personality

Do you think Luke practiced? Because personally I once ran through 3 lanes of traffic and punched a truck, then casually avoided the stormtroopers sent after me. Surely I could declare victory unless someone does better. Of course, I was once a boy, I may not know better.

Re: Rey has no.personality

No but I have done it in full combat load over a Waty (Man made canal in shÍtty countries like Afghanistan. The battle load amounted to about 180 pounds with 8 full magazines attached to my flack jacket. So I think holding a 90 to 110 person would not be much of a problem.

Re: Rey has no.personality

Sorry man, but if you actually did that then you'd know it was something different you were talking about to begin with. But lets humor you, 90 to 110 person plus yourself on one arm, how does that compare to the bs you just insulted us with?

But I will not rub in the pathetic lengths you went to to discredit a movie. Like you know a 180 combat load is heavy but anyone could do it, sh!t, even you could do it. So it takes nothing, ok, go and tell real infantry they are soft full of *beep* babies doing what anyone in a movie could do.

Hang your head d!ck.

Re: Rey has no.personality


Sorry man, but if you actually did that then you'd know it was something different you were talking about to begin with.


Yes it is a little different if you were holding the person up with just your arm and they were not holding on to you pressing their body to you. You ever hold up you girlfriend and walk around with her? Not that hard. And if they cling on to you like the weight of a combat load than yes it is not very different.


But lets humor you, 90 to 110 person plus yourself on one arm, how does that compare to the bs you just insulted us with?



You ever see the picture of Ozzy holding up Randy Rhodes with one arm on stage. I can do this with my brother that ways about 135 as well. Just did it at a party the other week. banged his head on the ceiling and got a pretty good picture. You telling me I could not do this with a roughly 100 pound Leia. Maybe you can't if you are weak and pathetic but I certainly can. But I am a solid 200 pound Man. So I am by no means a small farm boy so there was a bit of suspension of belief in ANH, but it is not that much of a stretch.


But I will not rub in the pathetic lengths you went to to discredit a movie.


Funny you claim that because that is actually exactly what you are doing, and rather poorly too.


Like you know a 180 combat load is heavy but anyone could do it, sh!t, even you could do it.


I did not say anyone could do it. But I have. I am sure I am not superman neither was the other 32 men that were with me. But we all did it none the less. some of these marines were smaller than Luke and yet still managed to swing across the watty with full loads. Swing might be a bit of stretch of words though, it was more like a jump with using rope as a booster.


So it takes nothing, ok, go and tell real infantry they are soft full of *beep* babies doing what anyone in a movie could do.



Real infantry Marines do not take pride in their physical strength but their skills with rifles, fighting prowess, and ability to kill the enemy. I am more proud of my ability to effectively hit a target from 500+ meters than I am being able to bench 300 pounds (this one I can't do anymore).

I like though that you doubt what I have done and what I can do, and think that somehow invalidates my overall argument. That is called a deflection, a fallacy. It is a bad argument.

Re: Rey has no.personality

Obviously I was talking about the arm swinging on the cable, not the arm holding a person doing most of the holding for you. But sure you sound like you have experience if you didn't know that.

Is it usual for 200 pound men to carry 180 pounds in combat load? How far can you carry your own body weight?

Is it normal to cross a body of water carrying your whole combat load? My experience is not in the marines but it is hilarious to think that marines don't know how to take backpacks off to make crossings like it is preferable to risk men and equipment in a gung-ho display of stupidity.

Exactly what is a waty or watty? Google doesn't know, can you spell, are you spelling wrong or do you just not know the word because someone said it to you instead of spelling it for you? Did you just not say canal because it sounded better that you did it in the sandbox?

But yeah the funny part is here you are trying to tell me about your strength, presumably your marine experience but still anyone could do it just because and not because you're a 200 pound man baby.


I like though that you doubt what I have done and what I can do, and think that somehow invalidates my overall argument.
Only because of 2 reasons, first you're full of sh!t, second because you had to spell out just how hard you are to prove you could do it while arguing anyone could. Next time try something simple like, "when I was in high school I had to climb a rope with a friend on my back". And you're so proud of your marine experience that you can use it to argue about a movie and simultaneously diminish that experience.

Re: Rey has no.personality


Obviously I was talking about the arm swinging on the cable, not the arm holding a person doing most of the holding for you. But sure you sound like you have experience if you didn't know that.


Okay I see what you are saying now. It does not make that much of a difference. especially since the wire was attached to his belt. But for the sake of argument, we would climb ropes in full battle load, flack ammo and day packs, that amounted to anywhere between 50 to 100 pounds. So it very much can be done and if it can be done by thousands of real life people it is not that impressive of a movie feat.


Is it usual for 200 pound men to carry 180 pounds in combat load? How far can you carry your own body weight?



hahaha I was not even a machine gunner or a 80 mm mortar man. They had even more weight. And some of them were smaller than me. But in regards to usually carrying 180 pounds, yes it is very usual to carry that amount. The goal was to reduce as much weight as possible. How far can I carry that weight you ask? do you mean in just walking or climbing/holding it up. for the former I have done more than 50 kilometers humps. For the later Long enough to climb to the top of a rope.


Is it normal to cross a body of water carrying your whole combat load? My experience is not in the marines but it is hilarious to think that marines don't know how to take backpacks off to make crossings like it is preferable to risk men and equipment in a gung-ho display of stupidity.



obviously you have no military experience and do not understand when time has priority. There was no time to take the gear off. that is why we did it. Marines are not as stupid as you seem to think.



Exactly what is a waty or watty? Google doesn't know, can you spell, are you spelling wrong or do you just not know the word because someone said it to you instead of spelling it for you? Did you just not say canal because it sounded better that you did it in the sandbox?


You know I have not ever seen it in writing as far as I can tell. That is what the local Afghani's called it, I compare it to a canal because it is the closest thing I can find for comparison. I could be spelling it wrong, I did fail spelling for marines 7 times, MCI's were stupid anyway. Or it might not even have an English equivalent as far as I know.


But yeah the funny part is here you are trying to tell me about your strength, presumably your marine experience but still anyone could do it just because and not because you're a 200 pound man baby.



this has nothing to do with anything. re-read your comment here, totally nonsensical.


Only because of 2 reasons, first you're full of sh!t, second because you had to spell out just how hard you are to prove you could do it while arguing anyone could. Next time try something simple like, "when I was in high school I had to climb a rope with a friend on my back".


Well if I tried claiming to climb a rope with a friend on my back that would make me full of shÌt because that never happened. The stuff I said did. The proof is that what Luke did was in ANH is not that impressive of a feat because even I can do it, a real life person.


And you're so proud of your marine experience that you can use it to argue about a movie and simultaneously diminish that experience.


I do not think an ignorant person such as yourself could ever under the pride and disgrace that comes with such an experience. But I use whatever tools available in my knowledge and experience to make my points as clear as possible.

Re: Rey has no.personality

Ok, drunk interneting is always annoying the next day.

If I can follow your argument, you say swinging across a chasm is so easy even you can do it, which minimises the act. Then you qualify that by claiming to be capable of carrying a heavier weight across a body of water because you are/were a marine that could carry his own weight in gear, which doesn't really minimise the act at all. You then minimise it again by claiming that since you're a real person and a real person could do it then basically anyone can. I think.

So I am looking at Mark Hamill and I am not thinking that he went through military selection, training and conditioning. Now I am thinking that most people have not been through military selection, training and conditioning but you're making it sound like I could walk down the street, pick someone at random, strap 180 pounds of gear on them and they should be able to do at least a few k's.

Is that really an opinion that can be developed by someone who went through marine training? You just assume anyone can pull mountain climbing gear out of their pocket and swing like Tarzan with Jane without a care, even Mark Hamill.

Re: Rey has no.personality

You are still missing the point. The only point I am making is that look swinging across a chasm with a rope hanging on to Leia is not that impressive of a feat for an action hero because real people can do similar acts. Not trying to minimize the act itself just identify how and why it is believable and acceptable in the film.

I do not assume that anyone can do it, you are the one that brought that into the conversation. I only said that even I could do it, addressing I am real and could do the same thing if needed to. That is the length of the point I was making.

Maybe I am being modest about what I have been through or something, but because there was men to my left and right that performed just as well and in some cases even superior to me; this might make me find such an act in the film to be not that impressive.

Re: Rey has no.personality

The line "even I could do it" has a meaning. Do you think that I could do something because you could do it? Would you think Luke could do something if you couldn't but other people could? Are you the benchmark? Am I the benchmark? Is someone else the benchmark? Or can we look at a character and work it out for ourselves?

But as you say, Luke can do these things just because he is an action hero and being an action hero gives you abilities you don't have to earn.

Re: Rey has no.personality


The line "even I could do it" has a meaning. Do you think that I could do something because you could do it? Would you think Luke could do something if you couldn't but other people could? Are you the benchmark? Am I the benchmark? Is someone else the benchmark? Or can we look at a character and work it out for ourselves?



I suppose that line could be taken out of context. like I said though, what Luke did in that scene is just not that impressive of an action hero feat because real people can do it, it makes it believable and grounded in reality. Not saying that anyone can do it and that those that can did not perform an impressive feat. Although I do not find it to be impressive.



But as you say, Luke can do these things just because he is an action hero and being an action hero gives you abilities you don't have to earn.


Well part of what I am saying is that what Luke there was not an earned ability because it was not a crazy special achievement. piloting the x-wing and making that great shot were impressive achievements. Coming up with a plan to save Leia, was impressive. Holding his own in firefights with stormtroopers was impressive. Swinging across with leia hlding him not that impressive.

Re: Rey has no.personality

So you're still saying that if a marine can do it then anyone can?

Re: Rey has no.personality


So you're still saying that if a marine can do it then anyone can?


No, that is not what I am saying; damn it. what are you dense? I am say that if a marine can do it, it is not that impressive for a fictional action hero to do it. nothing more, nothing less.

what the hell is so freaking hard to grasp about that.

Re: Rey has no.personality

Your original statement was "even I could do that". But now you're basically saying that if it is in a movie then it's not impressive. It was in the movie to be impressive. A fighter pilot would probably call bs when a character climbs into a fighter and acts like a combat veteran rather than just go "pffft, I could do that". But that would be showing respect for his training and achievements.

Can you tell me how you assess Rey, do you give her credit for everything a marine could do?
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