The Lord Of The Rings : Saruman Wasn't Wise At All. He Was A Blundering Fool

Saruman Wasn't Wise At All. He Was A Blundering Fool

That was very obvious at the beginning when Gandalf ran to him "seeking his council" about the master ring and where it was. Gandalf totally took him into his confidence, but then Saruman broke it by revealing to Gandalf he was on Sauron's side.

If he kept Gandalf's trust, the Fellowship would have surely sought shelter at Isengard during their perilous quest to Morder and once Frodo was in his domain, Saruman could've taken the ring.

Saruman dug deep to create his huge Uruk-hai army, but he dug deeper into making himself more of a fool. He sent a band of Uruk-Hai out to get the ring from Frodo, but they got Merry and Pippin instead. The band never made it back to Isengard. They got slaughtered by the horse riders of Rohan.

Saruman also sent out 'Warg Riders' to kill the people of Rohan, but that was thwarted as well. The final blow came when his army of 10,000 descended upon Helm's Deep to start the process of killing all mankind, but that failed too.

The final blow came when he desecrated Fanghorn Forest by cutting down the trees there while creating his army. That riled up the ancient Ents who attacked Isengard and flooded it. He failed in every way possible, even when he lost, he still grasped at straws by taking over the Shire with his goons and turning the Hobbits into slaves. That didn't work either.

He failed at everything right from the beginning. Wise he might be, but in most other ways, he was not. He was a failure all through the ordeal.


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Re: Saruman Wasn't Wise At All. He Was A Blundering Fool

Yes Saruman failed.
But playing devil's advocate, he would have thought that sending Frodo (a Hobbit) into Mordor to destroy the Ring would be madness.

Saruman believed the best choice was to accept that Sauron would win and try to get the best deal by having Saruman try to control the Ring.
- As pointed out by Gandalf, there was no way to compromise with Sauron and only one could wield the Ring but Saruman could not understand that.
And also Saurman could not accept Gandalf's view that a very slim chance to destroy the Ring was the best option.
For Saruman what Gandalf wanted (a fool's chance) did not make sense.

BB ;-)

it is just in my opinion - imo - 🌈

Re: Saruman Wasn't Wise At All. He Was A Blundering Fool

Saruman didn't think Sauron was going to win, and had no intention of compromising with him. He wanted the ring for himself, so that HE could rule. Gandalf's statement that only one hand could wield the ring was in response to Saruman's attempt to get Gandalf to fall in with his plans--"do not trouble to say 'we'!"

Earth without art is just "eh."

Re: Saruman Wasn't Wise At All. He Was A Blundering Fool

Agreed, especially on the first point.

It's been a while since I've seen the movies or read the books, so my memory is not fresh on all counts, but I always thought it was foolish for him to his reveal his thoughts and motives to Gandalf so openly.

After that it was just one blunder after another.

(And Gandalf, incidentally, called him a fool openly when confronting him at Orthanc after the Ents destroyed Isengard, before breaking Saruman's staff. I guess that pretty much confirmed it.)

Re: Saruman Wasn't Wise At All. He Was A Blundering Fool

What was Saruman's plan? Why did he do these things?
Always interesting imo.

by kjnics;

"I always thought it was foolish for him to his reveal his thoughts and motives to Gandalf so openly."

In hindsight Saruman talking openly to Gandalf was a bad idea.
But I'll play devil's advocate again.

- What if Gandalf had agreed with Saruman's plan?
Then everything would have worked out the way Saruman wanted.
He and Gandalf could have intercepted Frodo on the road, taken the Ring and then Saruman could try to negotiate with Sauron to make Saruman and Gandalf Sauron's lieutenants in ruling Middle-earth.
Of course it did not happen.

- But once Gandalf refused to agree with the plan, Saruman did a smart thing. He imprisoned Gandalf.
If Gandalf had remained locked up, that would have crippled the Free Peoples in fighting Saruman and Sauron.
(Imagine no Gandalf at Rivendell or in Moria to fight the Balrog, or at Rohan or at Mina's Tirith.)

* Then came the crucial event for Saruman imo.
Gandalf escaped on the back of a giant Eagle.
And after that I agree with your comment;

"it was just one blunder after another"

For a reader of the Silmarillion the Eagles are more than just big birds who occasionally help Gandalf.
In the larger Tolkien myth the Eagles are the messengers of Manwe, the leader of the Valar.
An Eagle saving Gandalf should have chilled Saruman to the bone and led him to pull back and become neutral.
- The rescue by the Eagle was a clear signal that the Valar were on Gandalf's side and were willing to help him when necessary.
- And that is what happened later in the story;
When Gandalf is "killed" by the Balrog, the Valar resurrect him.
When Frodo and Sam are going to die, the Valar have the Eagles do another rescue with Gandalf.

So for me, after the Eagle rescues Gandalf at Isengard, which signals that the Valar are going to assist him, that's when Saruman became the fool until his death.

Imo at least, BB ;-)

it is just in my opinion - imo - 🌈

Re: Saruman Wasn't Wise At All. He Was A Blundering Fool

Saruman didn't want to negotiate with Sauron. He wanted to set himself up as ruler. He'd never have accepted the role of lieutenant.

Earth without art is just "eh."

Re: Saruman Wasn't Wise At All. He Was A Blundering Fool

That's one of the theories about what Saruman was trying to do. But it would not show him to be very wise would it?
Because then Saruman would be fighting both Mordor and the Free Peoples.

Instead I prefer my negotiation theory which also can be supported by the text and the films.

BB ;-)

it is just in my opinion - imo - 🌈

Re: Saruman Wasn't Wise At All. He Was A Blundering Fool

It wasn't wise, but that's what he was trying to do. He figured that he could pretend to side with Sauron while building his own army to conquer both. Don't forget, he expected to have the Ring. He thought that would make him invincible. He would NEVER have given the Ring to Sauron, any more than Boromir would have given the ring to Denethor.

I'm afraid your theory is not supported by either the text or the film. Remember, ONLY Bilbo and Sam ever gave up the ring voluntarily, and that was because they weren't power-hungry madmen like Saruman.

Earth without art is just "eh."

Re: Saruman Wasn't Wise At All. He Was A Blundering Fool

Tolkien's villains tend to be entities with vast power and skills, and moral and ethical blinkers that leave them with "blind spots" for their enemies to exploit.

Look- it's trying to think!

Re: Saruman Wasn't Wise At All. He Was A Blundering Fool

I agree with everything you said here, but at the same think about it like this... If he had not made all of those mistakes there would have been no trilogy because Saruman would have ended it all within the first movie/book.

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Re: Saruman Wasn't Wise At All. He Was A Blundering Fool


If he kept Gandalf's trust, the Fellowship would have surely sought shelter at Isengard during their perilous quest to Morder and once Frodo was in his domain, Saruman could've taken the ring.

Don't forget the forming of the Fellowship and the plan to take the ring to Mordor did not happen until the Council of Elrond (ie a while after Saruman revealed his intentions to Gandalf). Saruman, like Sauron and Boromir, probably couldn't conceive of the good guys wanting to destroy the Ring as opposed to either hiding it or giving it to someone who might be able to destroy the remnant of Sauron with it. He also did not know if Gandalf knew exactly where the Ring was but he figured he had a good idea. So he suggests they work together to claim the Ring which will give them the option to either destroy Sauron or cut a deal with him.
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